Liam on his new contract, Nade and Meechan

[footynut]

http://www.newsshopper.co.uk/sport/topsport/display.var.1539708.0.daish_happy_to_commit.php

[Stu M]

If York are going to pinch forwards from under our noses, maybe they'd like to loan Sodje back to us!

[Hempstead Gaz]

Daish, Kimble and Nade are GOOD signings.

If people disagree, or think we should wait until Christmas before deciding, tough s**t.

[jc]

It's such a relief to know in advance that Nade will definitely be a good player for us - thanks for the confirmation.

 

Still no official confirmation that he's actually signed, out of interest.

[JFW]

Originally Posted By: jc

Still no official confirmation that he's actually signed, out of interest.

Are you saying that Liam and/or the Newsshopper (Para. 5 of the article)are being economical with the truth? (Yes, I agree that it is not an official confirmation).

[nazer07]

Good to see that Laim and AK have signed new deals and also good to see us sign a striker who can score goals im hoping that Raphel well become our new Charlie Mac be interesting to see what players we have on trail does anyone know if we have any well known players on trail at the club?

[Bloodnock]

Good to see they have finally commited themselves at least for a year.

On the player front, does anyone feel that we are short of pace at the back now that wev'e lost Ross Smith?

All in all the midfield is the same,with a possible improvement with the signing of Barrett replacing Quinn, and provided the two strikers hit it off, having played together at the Muff it augurs well, so with luck we might not miss Charlie too much and the goals may get shared around more,especially as LD is looking for a further striker.

 

[John Pearce]

Quote from the News Shopper article................

 

"He added: "We've got a couple of useful trialists in and I'm having a close look at them.

 

"A lot of out of contract players are currently on trial at League clubs and not all of them will end up getting deals.

 

"It could well be a very similar case to last year when we got several very useful players in at the last minute."

 

I am sorry it it sounds a bit negative but the above all sounds a far too hit and miss to me ???

 

 

 

 

[Slartibartfast]

Sounds like common sense to me.

 

Every year players that trial at league clubs and don't get taken on are desperate to find a club in August that they can play full-time at.

Last year we were in a position to take advantage of it and picked up several very good youngsters, Liam is looking to do the same this year.

When trying to attract crowds we always bemoan the close proximity of so many league clubs but of course it is the players that aren't taken on at the likes of QPR, Charlton, Palace, Southend, and Gillingham (Sodge last year for instance)who will be looking for a local full-time club.

Of course if Liam had already blown the budget on contracts for every Tom, Dick or Harry just to make the numbers up in June we would not be in a position to make any late signings should they become available.

[Stu M]

Originally Posted By: John Pearce

sounds a far too hit and miss to me ???

So what's your guide to close-season management that would avoid it being hit and miss? As far as I see it, Daish - and most other managers - will have their ideal retention list, do their best to negotiate contracts with those players (unavoidably some will leave for better clubs), then attempt deals with those they think fit the bill (MacDonald, Barrett, Nade), some will slip through the net and go elsewhere (D'Sane possibly, Meechan), leaving any gaps left to be plugged by a considerable wealth of talent dropping out of the league.

Of course it's a bit hit and miss, that's the nature of it. But I can't see how else Daish could plan it, bar some miracle where he got all the players he wanted at the price he wanted them for by the end of June. Get real!

[Hempstead Gaz]

What I find dissappointing is that we seem unable to sign players on anything more than a 1 year contract. The result is that the best players we nuture and develop into the finished (or almost finished) article can leave on free transfers, where a longer contract could potentially see financial benefits to the club by way of transfer fees and sell-on fees.

 

Does it actually cost more to sign a player on a 2 year contract?

£500 per week is £500 per week whether it is paid for 1 year or 2 years.

Whilst I know it wouldn't actually stop our best players leaving, we could at least get some return on our investment.

We have tried almost everything to increase gates and income - with almost no result. One other way we haven't tried is investment in players and reaping the benefits (as other clubs have) in selling on to league clubs.

Opinions?

[David Holden]

Quote:

500 per week is £500 per week whether it is paid for 1 year or 2 years

 

Would you be happy if your employer said that this is your salary for this year, and by the way don't expect a pay rise next year?

 

If you want players to sign longer contracts then you either have to guarantee a pay rise that you may not be able to afford, or offer them more money from the start of the contract.

[Hempstead Gaz]

I'm a civil servant, David. My pay hasn't gone up in real terms for over 20 years. I'm actually earning LESS now than I did in 1995!!.

 

Could extended contracts be drawn up which include a basic rise after a year + a bonus (for appearances etc)?

 

Cannot speak for Fleet's players, but it must be a bloody horrible sort of life, being a transient 1 year contract player having to look for a new club, possibly 300 miles away each year.

Shirley it is far, far better to have a lesser wage but with the security that a 2/3 year contract brings?

[Slartibartfast]

Originally Posted By: Chatham Gary

We have tried almost everything to increase gates and income - with almost no result. One other way we haven't tried is investment in players and reaping the benefits (as other clubs have) in selling on to league clubs.
Opinions?

You are right C.G. we haven't tried the 'Leeds United' approach yet.

[John Pearce]

Originally Posted By: Chatham Gary

What I find dissappointing is that we seem unable to sign players on anything more than a 1 year contract.

It hardly instills confidence in players to even consider a 2 or 3 year contract, if offered, when the management team only agree/are offered a 1 year contact extension does it?

[John Pearce]

Originally Posted By: Stu M

Originally Posted By: John Pearce

sounds a far too hit and miss to me ???

So what's your guide to close-season management that would avoid it being hit and miss? As far as I see it, Daish - and most other managers - will have their ideal retention list, do their best to negotiate contracts with those players (unavoidably some will leave for better clubs), then attempt deals with those they think fit the bill (MacDonald, Barrett, Nade), some will slip through the net and go elsewhere (D'Sane possibly, Meechan), leaving any gaps left to be plugged by a considerable wealth of talent dropping out of the league.

Of course it's a bit hit and miss, that's the nature of it. But I can't see how else Daish could plan it, bar some miracle where he got all the players he wanted at the price he wanted them for by the end of June. Get real!

Whilst I accept that no club will ever get every player that they show interest in, I do not and cannot accept that a position so important as a main striker is to be left to the hit and miss system of perhaps finding a player good enough in pre-season trials.

Remember the club have lost, for good reason certainly from the player's point of view, the second highest goal scorer in the league last season as well as a player with the potential to be equally as good, if not better. As things stand at the moment I can't see that either of the strikers signed have the potential to score anywhere near the number of goals that Macdonald scored last season, between them.

Look what last season 'trials' came up with Varney? Played a handful of games and from memory scored a couple of goals and then disappeared from the face of the earth. Why did he not play any more games, I don't know but probably because he wasn't deemed to be good enough? An example of picking up players as a result of pre-season trials/friendlies.

[Stu M]

Originally Posted By: John Pearce

It hardly instills confidence in players to even consider a 2 or 3 year contract, if offered, when the management team only agree/are offered a 1 year contact extension does it?

You make it sound like a Fleetcentric problem, John, when the reality is it's endemic in football these days. Yes, some managers/players sign longer-term contracts (Harvey at FGR has just done so), but for the most part players are only willing to sign one-year contracts because they drop out of the league and are looking to get back in at the earliest opportunity. Their agents will always be on the lookout for bigger deals, so unless Fleet offer silly money up front, they'll likely tell their players to only sign for a year.

As for Daish and Kimble, of course they're only going to sign on for a year. Like young players, they're ambitious and they keep an open mind about the future... we've probably done well to hold onto them this season... many League Two clubs hand jobs to non-league managers with worse records.

And apart from all that, wouldn't it be a risky strategy offering two-year contracts to some players without seeing them in the Conference?

[Hempstead Gaz]

Nobody is suggesting we go down the "Leeds" route.

However, most clubs at this level do offer their best (or most promising) players something better than a 1 year, then goodbye contract.

Hypothetically, had Charlie been on a 2 year deal - with a 10% rise in year 2, he would have still gone to a league club, but we would have got his true market value (£200,000?) as opposed to what we did get - a big fat nothing.

Until our mindset changes, we will always be a small club, on a small budget, with big ambitions, and fighting way above our weight.

In order to compete with the "big" clubs in this league, and to have a realistic chance of promotion (and staying up) we do need to capitalise on our best assets, the players.

Get the best youngsters (Cronin, Coleman, Ricketts etc on 2 year contracts. So they get a pay rise after next year, if they do well , they will have earned it.

 

[Stu M]

Originally Posted By: John Pearce

Varney? An example of picking up players as a result of pre-season trials/friendlies.

You've used one example only though.

I could add Ross Smith, Cronin, De Bolla, Long and Coleman to that list.

Unless you're talking ONLY about strikers, in which case, yes, good strikers are probably not particularly abundant in pre-season trials but then I'm not expecting a 'new Charlie MacDonald' (while I'd like one). The reality is that most Conference clubs from year to year don't have 20-goal-a-season strikers (only four had last season) unless they've got someone really special.

I think it a bit unjustified to claim that Daish's lack of top-quality strikers at this point in the season is down to bad planning, hit or miss tactics, etc.

[Stu M]

Originally Posted By: Chatham Gary

Hypothetically, had Charlie been on a 2 year deal - with a 10% rise in year 2, he would have still gone to a league club, but we would have got his true market value (£200,000?) as opposed to what we did get - a big fat nothing.

True, but hypothetically, Charlie and his agent would be noting interest mounting from other clubs, calculating the fact he'd bagged a fair few goals and that a two-year contract would perhaps lower his future negotiating chances with League clubs if they had to pay a fee, and so a 10% rise and an extra six to 12 months on his Fleet contract probably wasn't worth it.

It's not all about what we offer players, it's about players/agents thinking ahead and making the quickest and biggest buck.