think I have done the right thing telling you all, you best check

[lovely stuff]

Cars would move faster than now.Buses a bit slower now..Ie..They would all run the same..They would be equal.

 

Your belief, that doubling the capacity of most main roads would slow down traffic, is hard to accept.

[coupwotcoup]

Why don't you tarts give it a bloody rest. Trust Zody to start all this crap off!!! Anyway you can all sod off to your new unsponsored league...we have new kids on the block now!!!

[Tom S]

Quote:

lovely stuff said:
Cars would move faster than now.Buses a bit slower now..Ie..They would all run the same..They would be equal.

And London would grind to a halt because there would be too much traffic going into too little space. We'd all be equally stuck.

[MbrunoB]

you know you'll miss us. <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/affig.gif" alt="" />

[zody]

hi Coupeeeeee, thought I get a mention somewhere in here,my best thread so far, may even beat your record of replies <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/bootyshake.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/bisou.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/elephant.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/excited.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/tongue2.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/wiggle.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/laughuncontrollable.gif" alt="" />

[lovely stuff]

I hope Hornchurch know what there in for,on this forum.There seems to a lot of people who resent supporter-run clubs,who dare to have 'ambition'.

[Tom S]

Quote:

coupwotcoup? said:
Why don't you tarts give it a bloody rest. !!

To be fair yours was the second or third posting that helped kick it all off (and I know I was the third or second!)

[coupwotcoup]

Actually looking at the potential of your unsponsored league site, it wouldn't surprise me if you guys stayed put. Not much of a challenge on there methinks.

Course I will miss you sweet hips!

[lovely stuff]

Quote:

Tom S said:

Quote:

lovely stuff said:
Cars would move faster than now.Buses a bit slower now..Ie..They would all run the same..They would be equal.

And London would grind to a halt because there would be too much traffic going into too little space. We'd all be equally stuck.

How do you come to a conclusion like that,Tom.More people would travel down any given mile, at any given time.

[Gazza]

Road humps make you drive slower....

 

Some do, however a lot of the ones around Enfield which consist of a cube in the road are a waste of money & time, a standard size cars width between wheels means you can drive over them with no effect.

 

I've been using the junction at Bullsmoor both as passenger & driver for 30 years, & it's never been as free flowing as it is now.....

 

When is that then 2am?? Ive lived on Bullsmoor Lane nearly 20 years now & have not noticed any difference, try negotiating your way up Bullsmoor Lane anytime after 15:30 & along Hertford road around 17:00.

 

All road humps should be dug up & replaced with cameras.

All schools should have speed cameras outside them & a 20mph zone during 08:00 & 09:30 then again between 15:00 & 16:30.

At the moment most speed cameras are on dual carriageways where no schools or shopping areas exist, proving its not safety thats paramount its money grabbing.

Until last November I had a clean driving liscence for 22 years, then I dared to drive over the speed limit (101mph)on the M4 at 07:00 on a Sat morning in middle of nowhere & got caught by "a man in a van" on a bridge.

I now have 6 points & paid a £500 fine, no problem I broke the law I get whats right, but is it? a neighbours son pulled for no tax & no insurance 3 points & £300 fine plus costs!!!!

"WHAT'S THAT ALL ABOUT"??

 

My 18 year old sons insurance on a 1.1 fiesta is £1140 TPFT, 3 times that of the fine for not having any insurance!

 

Tax the fuel not the car & like the idea of a bar code where the tax disc is for insurance.

 

Lightweight im now getting of my soapbox!!

[Tom S]

Quote:

lovely stuff said:

Quote:

Tom S said:

Quote:

lovely stuff said:
Cars would move faster than now.Buses a bit slower now..Ie..They would all run the same..They would be equal.

And London would grind to a halt because there would be too much traffic going into too little space. We'd all be equally stuck.

How do you come to a conclusion like that,Tom.More people would travel down any given mile, at any given time.

How do I reach that conclusion? From seeing the growth in traffic levels in the middle of London over the past 20+ years.

[lovely stuff]

So you've seen the growth,but still think that halving available roadspace to 90% of road traffic ,is a good way to deal with that growth ?

[Tom S]

That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that we need to persuade people that driving in London is not always necessary by making public transport a better option. In the short term that means greatly improving the attractions bus network - by increasing the number/capacity of buses (either more buses or bigger buses) and making them run faster - because improvements to tube and rail will take too long. The current level of car usage in London is simply unsustainable.

 

You're coming at this from the angle that everyone who wants to drive in London should be able to without congestion. I'm saying that is an unrealistic aim.

[coupwotcoup]

Whoops!

[lovely stuff]

Quote:

Tom S said:
That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that we need to persuade people that driving in London is not always necessary by making public transport a better option. In the short term that means greatly improving the attractions bus network - by increasing the number/capacity of buses (either more buses or bigger buses) and making them run faster - because improvements to tube and rail will take too long. The current level of car usage in London is simply unsustainable.

You're coming at this from the angle that everyone who wants to drive in London should be able to without congestion. I'm saying that is an unrealistic aim.

But you're advocating CAUSING congestion for cars,as a way of pursuading people onto public transport.Car owners pay massive amounts of tax each year.They deserve the best possible service.They need to know that the government are doing everything possible to minimise congestion,rather than artificailly causing congestion.

The government are not dealing with 'today', but causing misery in the hope of a better 'tomorrow'.Most people outside of rush hours,would like to travel by car (and pay through the nose for that priviledge).The government should do everything possible to make sure they can travel freely.London could be kept running relatively freely to car traffic for the next 20/30 years at least ,if the will was there.The government are saying 'we think in the future London will grind to a halt from cars(mainly down to our lack od vision)',so we are going to artificially speed up that process,and force people on a form of transport they don't like,as a sort of social experiment.The motorist deserves better.

[Arkwright]

Quote:

lovely stuff said:

Quote:

Tom S said:
That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that we need to persuade people that driving in London is not always necessary by making public transport a better option. In the short term that means greatly improving the attractions bus network - by increasing the number/capacity of buses (either more buses or bigger buses) and making them run faster - because improvements to tube and rail will take too long. The current level of car usage in London is simply unsustainable.

You're coming at this from the angle that everyone who wants to drive in London should be able to without congestion. I'm saying that is an unrealistic aim.

But you're advocating CAUSING congestion for cars,as a way of pursuading people onto public transport.Car owners pay massive amounts of tax each year.They deserve the best possible service.They need to know that the government are doing everything possible to minimise congestion,rather than artificailly causing congestion.

The government are not dealing with 'today', but causing misery in the hope of a better 'tomorrow'.Most people outside of rush hours,would like to travel by car (and pay through the nose for that priviledge).The government should do everything possible to make sure they can travel freely.London could be kept running relatively freely to car traffic for the next 20/30 years at least ,if the will was there.The government are saying 'we think in the future London will grind to a halt from cars(mainly down to our lack od vision)',so we are going to artificially speed up that process,and force people on a form of transport they don't like,as a sort of social experiment.The motorist deserves better.

What a shame then that the Car lobby didn't use the General Election as an opportunity to see just how many people actually agree with them.

[TB&G]

Quote:

Arkwright said:

Quote:

lovely stuff said:

Quote:

Tom S said:
That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that we need to persuade people that driving in London is not always necessary by making public transport a better option. In the short term that means greatly improving the attractions bus network - by increasing the number/capacity of buses (either more buses or bigger buses) and making them run faster - because improvements to tube and rail will take too long. The current level of car usage in London is simply unsustainable.

You're coming at this from the angle that everyone who wants to drive in London should be able to without congestion. I'm saying that is an unrealistic aim.

But you're advocating CAUSING congestion for cars,as a way of pursuading people onto public transport.Car owners pay massive amounts of tax each year.They deserve the best possible service.They need to know that the government are doing everything possible to minimise congestion,rather than artificailly causing congestion.

The government are not dealing with 'today', but causing misery in the hope of a better 'tomorrow'.Most people outside of rush hours,would like to travel by car (and pay through the nose for that priviledge).The government should do everything possible to make sure they can travel freely.London could be kept running relatively freely to car traffic for the next 20/30 years at least ,if the will was there.The government are saying 'we think in the future London will grind to a halt from cars(mainly down to our lack od vision)',so we are going to artificially speed up that process,and force people on a form of transport they don't like,as a sort of social experiment.The motorist deserves better.

What a shame then that the Car lobby didn't use the General Election as an opportunity to see just how many people actually agree with them.

Don't think that a "Car User Party" would have picked up many votes.

Now London Borough's one would be a different thing!

[Tom S]

Quote:

Car owners pay massive amounts of tax each year.

Most of that tax is on fuel. If you don't use the car you don't pay that tax.

Quote:

The government are not dealing with 'today', but causing misery in the hope of a better 'tomorrow'

.

No. The misery is already there and was there even before the bus lane expansion.

Quote:

The government are saying 'we think in the future London will grind to a halt from cars(mainly down to our lack od vision)

No. The Government are saying London has already ground to a halt in many places.

Quote:

'so we are going to artificially speed up that process,and force people on a form of transport they don't like,as a sort of social experiment.The motorist deserves better.

Yet again you are completely ignoring the people who have no access to a car. They deserve better than to have their ONLY form of transport clogged up by people who could use buses but instead choose to pay higher taxes, increase pollution and cause congestion. It's not a social experiment it's a social necessity.

[lovely stuff]

Quote:

Most of that tax is on fuel. If you don't use the car you don't pay that tax.

 

If thats the case,why don't you just keep a cheap car,for the odd occassion you would like to use it? BECAUSE of the road tax,because of the MOT,because of the insurance (all these things are heavily taxed).So is buying a new or second hand car in the first place.Thats before we start talking about 78% tax on petrol.Britain has the cheapest oil at source in Europe.It becomes the most expensive after tax.

 

 

 

Quote:

No. The misery is already there and was there even before the bus lane expansion.

Balls was it.Can anyone on here honestly tell me that congestion is not a LOT worse since the bus lane epedemic.Add three times the amount of buses onto the road (all half empy outside rush hours) and you have the recipe for the chaos that we see at present.

 

Quote:

No. The Government are saying London has already ground to a halt in many places.

I bet they have.Thats exactally their policy,isn't it.

 

Quote:

Yet again you are completely ignoring the people who have no access to a car. They deserve better than to have their ONLY form of transport clogged up by people who could use buses but instead choose to pay higher taxes, increase pollution and cause congestion. It's not a social experiment it's a social necessity.

 

I'm not ignoring the people who have no access to a car.I wan't them to have equal use of the road.I just do not want someone who pays £1.20 to travel down the road,to have more rights than me who pays vastly more money to the government,in order to travel down that same road.The government want everyone to buy a car .Pay 4k a year to run it,BUT THEN try to stop them driving it. It ain't happening,and the quicker the government realise that,the quicker we can get traffic moving again.

Talking of increased pollution.A London bus creates 33 time the pollution of a single car,so unless there is more than 33 people on a bus,it is causing more pollution than if they were all driving cars.God knows how much diesel and pollution the average train produces.Electric trains require a lot of electricity in order to run the hundreds of miles of tracks.How do you think that energy is produced.Burning fossils fuels.So don't give me the enviroment arguement.

[Tom S]

"Equal treatment": 50 people on a bus should have the same space as 50 people in 50 cars. That's equal. Not 50 people in a bus having the same space as 1 person in a car.