What Potential

[Guest]

How much potential do fans think Margate have.

Me i look at places like Blackburn and Ipswich with similar sized populations to Thanet.

I see really small places like Torquay and Wrexham and cant quite understand why MFC have never been in the league proper.

 

I dont like the ongoing strategy of the club, the crappy stadium idea, the lack of reserve and youth teams. Training at Dartford and no local players.

 

If MFC was well run, I think they would be in the old third div at least. And potential crowds would be well over 5,000 average.

[Guest]

Stop talking rubbish and concentrate on getting Millwall into the Premiership Ray. <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />

[Guest]

So does nobody think the club has any potential then. Maybe thats down to relegation and the last few years.

[MargateFan]

One sceptic does not mean everyone. I think we have tremendous potential once the possibility of a stable future is assured.

 

But then again, most folk think I am a little mad.

 

The real potential would be realised I think with the commercial development also, because there are things within that application which would give so much value to the community. And we do seem to be losing most of the community attractions in the area, unless you like shopping, that is.

[Guest]

But you are a woman you are meant to like shopping.......it's in your genes !!!!

[MargateFan]

Not in mine! It's a chore if you ask me. Football is more fun.

[Guest]

What a lot of people ,like myself find frustrating is the fact that only a few years ago we were well on our way to achieving this potential.We were in the Conference crowds were well up, we had a commodity that drew people to the area ,and in the case of Doncaster and other distant clubs,these fans would spend a weekend in the town,early season in Dreamland,spending money locally,in Guest Houses,Hotels etc, etc. All good for the local economy.The club had sixteen youth teams u/10s up to u/16s run by the old Youth Section, Then it had u/18s and a reserve team as part of the main Club.There were hundreds of youngsters proud to play for and be part of MARGATE FOOTBALL CLUB.I am afraid the powers that be blew it all,The Chairman,Directors,Advisors I dont know,then the Council Leaders etc, again I dont know,but I believe it is all intertwined a joint effort by all and sundry has destroyed it all. The Club,the Area the Lot and now we have to start all over again. IT SHOULD NOT BE NECESSARY!!!! <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />

[MargateFan]

You can say that again! But starting again we are, and that is better than not being around at all. And we have all got to know each other as fans, and have come together in support of the club, getting to know the manager, players and club officials as they are now, and so much the better for that. So as we cannot go back in time, we can at least say where it is that we want to go forward to, as having been there before, we know what it is like. So at some point we will have to let old resentments about the past go, and all work together to bring back the good times. I see from the Save Dreamland site that they are trying to do just that, and we can all do the same for our club if there is the will. To be a bit trite, from small acorns etc. etc.

[Guest]

Point taken.The past is the past.Onwards and upwards.You have my full support!!! <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

[Guest]

I think it is really sad how that potential has been allowed to waste away.

But the good thing is that at least the conference years gave fans a taste of what could be.

But the way the club was managed by Piper and Parmenter needs to be totally reversed.

They should have taken the ground redevelopment step by step starting with a bigger West Side Terrace and then going on to do the main stand.

It would have paid for itself in increased crowds and sponsorship.

The commercial plan is crap, they should concentrate on the Football.

[MargateFan]

I think you take a far too simplistic outlook on stadium development, Ray. Very few clubs can survive on gate receipts alone, and rely also on generosity of various shareholders, and some amount of commercial activity such as advertising revenue, etc. And this is normally just about sufficient to keep playing without running into too much annual debt. Some clubs do not make it and go into administration, bigger clubs than us, too. So when a club needs to make improvements, or rebuild its ground, and has ambition that looks justified by performance, there is no-one going to say to them 'sure, here's three quarters of a million quid, off you go'. If you take out a loan, repayments have to be made, and whoever loans you the money will want some reasonably concrete guarantees that they will recoup their outlay, with substantial interest. Although venture capitalists factor in risk, they want a highter reward if there is higher risk, and football is a risky business.

So what is a club to do? In order to get funding for ground improvements they have to make the development attractive to the money men, and not just for a few short years, but for a long period into the future. And it has been proven time and time again that those clubs that prosper are the ones that have income streams from activities outside the core business.

This is the harsh reality of football today, it is not just sport, if you want to succeed you need to consider these financial factors. So saying that the commercial side of the development is not required is very short-sighted and in my opinion, wrong.

So unless you have a spare three quarters of a million quid or so that you want to give away and not seek a return on, or you want the club to forever teeter on the edge of extinction, or stay forever in the lower leagues with no expectation of any success in the future, by all means let us forget the commercial aspects of the planning application.

[michael]

Spot on imo MF

[Guest]

1st step. Getting back to HP

2nd. Forming a reserves for next season.

3rd .Youth setup.

 

All of the above was sugested by KP at the last supporters meeting. He said that he had a youth section in mind of whom had previously approached him. If we get all of the above and prove to our council that we are putting something back into the community, then hopefully they will help us . Dont hold your breath though.

[Guest]

Margatefan

No im not opposed to all commercial activities but its not a majic wand, that is bound to be good for Football as the core business.

Just look at Chelsea, the Bates motel complex has been a drain on their core business. Spurs also screwed up with their diversification in to the commercial world.

And the commercial plans of MFC look worryingly badly thought out.

 

Plenty of clubs rely on mainly football activities

and without getting that side right. Why should anyone have any confidence in their plans to diversify the business.

 

If MFC had gradually done the ground up, they would have had additional money through increased crowds and sponsorship.

Instead they left HP with no realsitic plan or timescale to return. They have lost a fortune in lost fans and rent to Dover&Ashford.

How many businessmen do you think would trust them to run a business?

[MargateFan]

The commercial part of the plan is there, as far as I know, to support the costs of developing the ground. What is so poorly thought out? The five-a-side pitches? Is there a problem when I hear that the current ones available in Thanet are over subscribed, is it not a good idea to provide some extra capacity for healthy sporting activity that is obviously popular? A full size practice pitch? Do we want a youth and reserves team? Anywhere else seem logical for them to train? Good thing to have for the local community? A health and fitness centre? Bad thing for the area? Conference and banqueting? Is this not an advantage for providing facilities for sponsors and supporting businesses, as well as providing an interesting venue for other promotional activities. How many decent conference venues are there in Thanet? For that matter, how many decent hotels? Is it not a reasonable assumption that people travelling to the club from far away destinations may want somewhere to stay? That sponsors may require guest facilities? That the developers have done their research to make reasonable assumptions about room use? A new state of the art stadium with potential to support league football? Is this a bad idea? Plenty of room for expanding the support base, don't you think?

And as far as developing the stadium goes, think back to the state of Hartsdown before the development, much loved but very run down and out of date. Incremental improvements may have been an option, but could they have been done in time to satisfy the Conference? And was the funding available, without the commercial plan, to achieve this piecemeal? And remember that the planning application had been approved by the previous council, there was a venture partner involved that appeared to be expert in those types of development - anyone at the time with a crystal ball knew they would go bust? No-one at the time was saying 'hold on a minute chaps, your ground share will extend to three years, you will lose a lot of fans and pay enormous amounts out in rents for other grounds', and then the club went ahead willy nilly ignoring this sage advice. MFC made a decision at the time that did not pan out. Since then they have been busting a gut to keep going and get the project back on track.

Mr Lever seems perfectly happy to be in partnership alongside the Club, and he is a very successful businessman on a scale that we do not see much around this area, certainly in terms of willingness to help achieve the club's aims.

We could say IF this and IF that until out faces turned blue, that does not have any bearing on the fact that we are here now, this is the situation as it is, and we have to move forward at some point and not keep bitching about everything past.

[blueblood]

please lay out your gradual developement plan for the ground. Taking into account the slope and its effect on levels/condemmed stand ect.Also taking into account the unforseen problems with stadia and a local leisure operator,what would you have done?. Obviously you have the luxuriouse advantage of hindsite. I eagerly await you reply.

[Guest]

Quote:

MargateFan said:
A health and fitness centre? Bad thing for the area? Conference and banqueting? Is this not an advantage for providing facilities for sponsors and supporting businesses, as well as providing an interesting venue for other promotional activities. How many decent conference venues are there in Thanet? For that matter, how many decent hotels? Is it not a reasonable assumption that people travelling to the club from far away destinations may want somewhere to stay? That sponsors may require guest facilities? That the developers have done their research to make reasonable assumptions about room use?

Does anyone seriously believe that the best place for a new hotel in Margate is well away from the sea at Hartsdown park???
Thanet needs to look at what businessmen call its USP Unique selling position. That is it's coastline.
And who really would want to hold a conference at Hartsdown Park? cant see too many takers myself.

[Guest]

Quote:

blueblood said:
please lay out your gradual developement plan for the ground. Taking into account the slope and its effect on levels/condemmed stand ect.Also taking into account the unforseen problems with stadia and a local leisure operator,what would you have done?. Obviously you have the luxuriouse advantage of hindsite. I eagerly await you reply.

When the club were going for promotion to the conference they built a new west side.
It should have been bigger. That season more people would have had a good place to view the matches and crowds would have gone up.
The clubs west side showed a lack of ambition,it was a mistake. Bigger crowds would have led to more sponsorship. After the 1st season in the conference they should have done what Stevenage did built a main stand for about 500 people that could be extended either side.
They could have raised the money for this by sponsorship and selling 5 year season tickets.

The increased crowds and sponsors would have given them a much firmer base. And the Club would have stayed where it belongs at Hartsdown Park.

[MargateFan]

Showed a lack of ambition with the west side, then too much ambition with the total develoment. Just can't win when you look back, can you?

[Gringo]

Understand what your saying but the way things are. Yes people do want to be away from the sea. It is bedsit land if i were visiting i would like to stay well away from that. And visit that in the daytime and retreat at night. Thats the sorry state the town is in.