Bullocks

[A Non E Mouse]

Feel I might as well put fingers to keyboard after yeterdays game and set the ball rolling for some opinions on what did or did not happen.

 

I mentioned in a previous thread that the fans from a number of other clubs had said that Hereford were a very good side and liked to play football. Indeed they were probably the best team I have seen so far. Quick to get the ball forward - and to feet. Full timers or otherwise you could see the difference in first touch and off the ball movement. Good away support and officials who were generally OK.

 

However, here comes my list of disappointments.......

 

Firstly the size of crowd - when you deduct the amount of away support and the fact that Hereford are an ex-league club moving towards a play off place - I felt there could have been a few more in attendance and we should have broken the thousand mark.

 

Hallett and Williams starting and suprisingly Keeling being left on the bench. Perhaps bringing on two new players against a good Hereford side was being a little to optimistic - although hindsight is a good thing.

 

Felt Williams generally done quite well, although he never had an opportunity to get forward in support. Competed for the whole game. However the midfield as a unit never really clicked and we were always being over run. Give up watching their number 3 sprint two thirds of the pitch along that side.

 

We did very little in causing them problems - little or no game play from the middle and nothing being whipped in from the wings to cause them problems until Keeling came on.

 

Should we have changed formation for this game - going four at the back? either way defensively we were a yard off the ball.

 

Gavin has done very well - but he was caught on quite a few occassions yeterday. Not the only one at fault though. Their first goal seemed very simlar to the one conceeded at Northwich - given to much time and space to turn and pick his spot.

The second goal every one seemed to be ball watching as Cowans was well beaten on the line and their player had time to pick his spot and whip a ball in close to the post and Williams came in unmarked and stuck the second in.

Third goal left two players unmarked apart from Greggors to go up and header home.

Fourth goal - well - why does Cowans go up to take free kicks?? what is that about.....can anyone explain this to me? I'm not aware of his skills at curling the ball - anyway it rebounds off the wall and Hereford, who didn't need an invitation to play a quick direct ball forward ended up scoring their fourth with no one really able to cover Cowans who couldn't get back.

 

Generally, IMHO I don't think we got the formation or team right.

 

Greggors, I don't think, has scored from open play. He's good working with Lee but at the moment I'm not sure he would warrent a starting position as an out and out striker. This only left Jason (presume Junior was injured)- who tried but against experienced full timers never looked strong on the ball. Keeling should have started or came on a lot earlier. When he did we had our best spell and started to create a few half chances. Should we have changed formation for this game with four at the back?

 

Not many positives from yesterday - and Accy away will be another tough test. <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/sad.gif" alt="" />

 

Anyone got any news on those that are out injured?

[CIFCislander]

i heard boylan say in the bar that he expects to be back in about 4 wks. i saw dobbo doing some light training before the game and junior pulled a hamstring the thursday befor aldershot game so not sure how long he will be out for.

 

As usual there is no info about them on the website <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />

[Guest]

You mentioned three players in particular, cowan, hallet & gregory, for the first he is only able to compete at this level when we play the basement sides like in previous weeks but when the teams are better he is not good enough, also i have to agree either he or whoever tells him to take free kicks are in dream land - whats wrong with minton taking them or at least someone that can actually kick a ball properly because this is also something cowan struggles with when under the slightest of pressure.

secondly young hallet this was a baptism of fire for the poor lad as he is not ready for this level

as his touch, lack of movement, and awareness of his teams mates showed

thirdly gregory? unfortunately is not good enough either as you stated he has scored but only 2 penalties & nothing in open play which sadly means we need a striker that is fit,fast,mobile & strong.

On a positive note i thought the new lad williamson showed excellant touch's & did not need two touchs where one will do, created space &

did not do alot wrong.

Generally we seem to favour dropping the wrong players & leaving out ones that cleary deserve playing more ie smith he was excellant against Aldershot only to find himself dropped this week.

On a defending note we have chenners back, also theobaled whos is out on loan but surely is a cut above cowans for the central defenders role.

Anyway i am sure jeff will get it right as in the past & i am sure when all our players are fit plus an addition/change in personnel we will be back in contention

[CIFCislander]

I feel your being a bit harsh there on gav as he has had some exellent games for us this season although yesterday wasnt one of them he definatly is good enough for this level i feel.

i was quite surprised about keeling & sedgemore being dropped & hallet did seem well out of his depth yesterday.

i thought duffy & keeling were our best players yesterday with duffy just edging our MOTM.

[Exile]

At times yesterday it was men against boys, have to say Hereford looked a good side, not sure why they are not nearer the top of the league. We used the long ball far too often - generally it came straight back - and our midfield was overrun. However Williamson looked good, always seemed to have time on the ball and generally played the simple pass. One area we must improve on is set pieces: hardly any of our corners or free kicks reached a Canvey player. Agree with the observation above re lack of info on injured players - or is this something to do with not giving the opposition any info ? We need to learn some lessons from yesterday, and recover our early season form (which I think means getting some injured players back). And let's get behind the team (see Wardy's column in Saturday's programme).

[CANV EFM]

wheres mad dog?

[Guest]

Leaving the ground I expected to see some far more negative comments on here, particularly as I heard one or two mump eads booing at the end.

 

I thought we were out classed and the critics above seemed to have got it fair and right.

 

Mid field was away with the clouds and when we got the ball forward we did not hold it.

 

Greggors needs to learn a different trick, people have seen that fall on the floor in front of a defender nonsense so many times, we are learning this league and as the season goes on I have no doubt we will improve.

[Guest]

We need speed.....lightening speed! Quality crossing from the wings wouldn't go a miss either!

 

Time and time again we get the ball in good positions out wide....and the balls into the box have been awful....thats if they reach the box and don't go out for a gaol kick!

 

Aldershot and Hereford both delivered quality into the box....we need to look into this!

[ronin]

Very poor game from our point of view, Hereford were the best side i`ve seen this season but we were poor. The whole side looks short of confidence and we need to change that attitude soon before a rot sets in. The only player who can take any credit out of the game is Williamson, nice and tidy on the ball and rarely gave it away.

 

Our best results have come when we have played Sterling,Chenery and McGhee as a back 3, if they are all fit i hope we go back to that defence.

[Phil Old Boy]

You can see that if we are seek promotion in future, the team may have to have a total rebuild from the one at present and going full time would be necessary also.

 

Think that “Anonymous” has hit the nail on the head meaning the lack of pace in the team.

The thing that caught my eye a couple of years ago when we played Aldershot at home was the difference in pace which caused us trouble and got them out of situations. That speed held them in good stead the following season in the Conf where they made the play off final.

 

One thought is to play both Wardy and Smith at the back, purely as they mainly have pace to get us out of trouble. Think this has been tried before however with mixed success. Over Gravesend when we won 1-0 in a big one a few years ago, it worked there.

 

Using the word perhaps as suggestions.

Perhaps we need to go to 4-4-2.

Perhaps we need wide men who can cut in more effectively at present with enough speed to end up in the middle just outside the box, not only to the out side of the penalty area on the wing.

Perhaps we need two great lumps in the middle also, although one play maker may work okay.

And perhaps we need a front line that are capable of making opposing defensives work hard, can hold the ball and generally who’s work rate is more than current.

 

I pray that we can get some points in the coming months. The Christmas period looks like an area where we really have to take as many points as we can. As we know there are no “easier games” than others, but Feb & March look particularly hard.

[pabird]

I feel like an intruder but knowing the manner in which Canvey prefer to play here goes

Be there four or three at the back you cannot have all 3/4 as macho "Ill get my head to the ball first" type CBs, you must have at least one covering defender for whom it is natural to cover across the back

In mid-field there has to be the player who is always in space to collect the easy ball, bags of stamina and see!s the game as a string of "easy" movements you then need a ball winner in front of the back 4/3 (Dobbo) who again see!s his job as winning the ball and give it easy

The mid-field or fullback positions must have player(s) prepared and with the skills able to get to the dead ball line

4-4-2 OR 4-5-1 OR 3-4-1-2 OR any other number of set-ups cannot be achieved by simply telling players what you want

If you have the money you buy players who naturally do the role you want or if the money is not available in large lumps you play a system to match the players you can afford

I have always felt the very wrong route is to ask players to play a style that is not natural to them (as individuals) IE Duffers is not a defender and Cowans is not a thinker Wardy is not a cover player and Greg is not a speed man

[A Non E Mouse]

You make a good point - the players should feel comfortable in the role in which they are being asked to play. I wouldn't say everyone had an off day on Saturday - the line up, tactics (formation)and substitutions just didn't feel right for this game - oh, and Hereford were very good.

 

Felt this lay with the management. However, we had injuries, new players and a failed attempt to draught someone in on loan to help our depleted strike force. I therefore can't blame the coaching staff for saturday either - s*** happens and I'm sure Jeff and Glenn will have learned from it. We seem to have a large squad but limited somehow in who we can play, position and who they "combine" with.

 

Gavin is a good defender - he is capable of playing at this level. But he isn't going to be as good as those that are picked to play for Hereford, Carlisle or Barnet. Thats why we are a mid table team. We will consolidate this season, but if we want to be a title chasing team then many players, including some fan favourites, will not make the grade. How many players in the squad at the moment can you honestly say would be included in a title chasing side? At the moment I would point to four Keeling, Minton (on his day), Boylan and possibly Potter (I'm sure others will have their thoughts and possibly disagree). Many of the others can play at this level, but will not be title chasing material and this may also include people like Kennedy and Wardy.

 

Defensively we have done very well and again its getting the right combination. Mad dog is a solid defender, but a creative play maker linking with our midfield - I think not. Will Chenners make a difference? He was doing well until injured, but his distribution is poor and a number of fans were starting to feel he was playing because he was a "favourite".

 

Dobbo may well prove to be the missing part of the jigsaw for midfield - a "battler" in midfield - also feel he is a liability with the officials. Has Goodwin done anything wrong not to be included in a starting line up?

 

I have mentioned Duffers on a number of occassions and I just don't feel he does enough to warrant a start - he doesn't create enough on that side. I feel happier when he is running at someone and taking them on, but he seems to prefer to stop and pass back nowadays - perhaps its a confidence thing - the difference between Kelling and Duffers is enourmous. As mentioned, at the end of last season and throughout this, we have got in and around the oppositions danger area and we start passing the ball backwards and forwards until we are closed down and the attack fails. We fail to do the simple things sometimes and either run at people, whip in crosses or just take a shot.

 

We lack a striker at the moment and I hope Junior isn't out for to long. Jason will need time to get used to this level of football. Greggors playing as a target man has its limitations and Ollie has been able to create and score more.

 

At the end of the day I think the lads did try on Saturday - we were just totally outclassed. We are a mid table team and every now and then we will get a tonking - we are just not used to seeing it.

 

So - hands up all those who are going to Hereford at the end of Feb <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> well it should entertaining if nothing else..........

[Guest]

your right duffy is not a defender but a good attacking midfeilder,how easy was it for there winger to skip past him for there second

[South Mouth]

We need a big lad at the back like these Northern teams like Halifax have and we need a Stimmo sort of player to boss about the opposition and get in hard so to set an example. Also i think Greggors is being found out by Conference defenders with the whole backing in and then falling over trick and either needs another game plan or we need to replace him by buying another striker because Junior and Boylan dont mix well.

[Guest]

As far as our defence is concerned we can't lose sight of the fact that Cowan has played well since being given his chance this season, like the game against York, when we defended well, and the win at Stevenage. He wins everything in the air and is definitely our most comfortable defender on the ball. Also you don't play for the England non league side if you are a bad player. He would still be my first choice centre half, probably with Wardy and Stirling.

 

Whatever defence we would have had out against Hereford would have struggled, they were different class and it is no shame to lose to them.

We need to remember that most of the sides we are up against are full time and not the kind of shocking teams we were used to in the Ryman. A good season would be a top ten finish and then look to build for next year.

I think that our fans have been spoilt by the success of the last few years and are not sure how to handle a couple of defeats.

[CANV EFM]

Quote:

.
I think that our fans have been spoilt by the success of the last few years and are not sure how to handle a couple of defeats.

spot on.. and hereford were/are different gravy