RELEGION

[CANV EFM]

the organisation has taken over the principle.. fk me the vatican has more dough and influence than most countries outside of G10

[The Invisible Man]

Happy old bean, your first reply demonstrates my point more succintly than I could ever hope to.

 

As a technicality, as one who studies the past, I would point out that there is no proof that Jesus existed. There is some (suspect) documentary evidence, as we archaeologists call it, of a person of that name, but that is NOT proof. There is certianly no evidence of that person being of a supernatural nature.

 

As for CANV's aerial abilities, I remain to be convinced. Would I be correct in assuming that certain substances are involved in the process?

[CANV EFM]

if you can base a relgion that has encompassed a third of the globe of the premise that a carpenters son might have discovered a way of finding fish, founding unwins and getting a kicking from the romans then surely it no small leap to believe i can actually get airbourne..! ;-)

[Colin, Germany]

The evidence that Jesus existed is quite strong. Invis, what evidence do you require before you accept that a historical figure existed?

[The Invisible Man]

All documentary evidence of the past has to be treated with the appropriate degree of caution. One must be aware of the context in which it was written, who wrote it and why. For example, the writings of Caesar or Tacitus cannot be taken literally.

 

Put crudely, people don't always write the truth, and always write from a certain perspective: they are likely to have an axe to grind. Caesar of course was talking himself up, for example, for political reasons.

 

The main evidence for a person named Jesus is the bible, as far as I am aware (bear in mind that this is not my period). This is a religious, possibly even a political, text and as such has to be treated with great caution: this is not to say dismissed, but equally it should not be taken at face value on its own. What do we know of the origin of these texts? Perhaps others can enlighten me, but there may be corrobaritive Roman documentary evidence of an execution in about the right period of a person answering the general description. That would be good evidence.

 

Remember however that evidence is not proof. The evidence must be examined and an interpretation drawn. A good archaeologist or historian is always cautious. I may be accused of bias towards my own discipline but archaeological evidence is more convincing.

 

So, as I said before, there is some documentary evidence for the existence that a historical figure now known as Jesus. There is documentary evidence that Sherlock Holmes, Biggles, the Famous Five and Noddy also existed. These of course can be countered as they are known to be fictional. Robin Hood is more problematic, King Arthur even more so. Extend the time elapsed to 2000 years and the picture is even more uncertain.

 

So let's say such a figure existed, which frankly I suspect is likely to be the case. What and who was he? A supernatural figure walking on lakes, turning water into wine and raising the dead? We have the four religious texts of uncertain provenance claiming that to be the case. Or was there a mortal figure, perhaps some kind of spiritual or political leader?

 

I know where my money is.

 

I think I just saw CANV whizzing past my window................

[Uncle Urchin]

'the man' was an early day direct salesman.....a charlatan and philanderer who wondered the middle east selling cures to the afflicted and [***!!***]*ing young virgins in exchange for fishes and loaves.... <img src="/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" />

 

top gezza.... <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />.......anyway...

 

there is no doubt in my mind that the old test' is the best NOVEL ever written and the new test' the biggest load of bollox since I invented the 'half nelson' sales 'close' in 1971.... <img src="/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

 

ancient egypt is the key to early civilisation and graham hancock is king.....well...its quite obvious that atlantis is underneath antartica aint it.... <img src="/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" />

 

ha ha ha...quality..... <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

 

I went into a church once and all the fckin roof timbers started trembling...scary it was.... <img src="/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

 

real scary..... <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

 

I had to run out and all the altar silver got caught under me trench coat..... <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

[The Invisible Man]

Bug ger Egypt. Weird lot. Too much marrying of brothers and and sisters and whatnot. Too many pointy buildings. All that sand addled their brains I reckon, got into all sorts of places.

 

Mesopotamia is the place for early civilisation. Sumarians and things like that. Still too much sand though.

 

Hancock is in fact the devil incarnate.

[Uncle Urchin]

on face value Vis you could be right.....

 

however....as an interested 'layman' in these matters of early civilisation...it has oft crossed my mind that ALL genuine clues in these matters come from SAND....now it could well be of course that Hx was the birthplace of man.....

 

but the fckin clay destroyed everything... <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

[mala_D]

I'm with Invis on this one, being also trained in the Historical Art/Science.

There is little documentary proof of the existence of Jesus, and [to reiterate Invis' point] what's to say in 3000 years time that people won't be thinking Noddy is a magical, mystical sprite who carried an important message for civilistion.

 

As for people living longer if they practise religion, that's just rubbish. Who sponsered the survey? Who conducted the survey? Who analysed the statistical results?

 

I seem to remember one of the large petrochemical companies sponsering research, the results of which deemed carbon-monxide [and other combusted gases] to have no link with the increase in asthma cases.

[Uncle Urchin]

we've just conducted a surevey that proved conclusively that asbestos is harmless and even prolongs life....

 

no fcker believes it though.... <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

[The Invisible Man]

Hornchurch could well be the place of origin of the human species. After all, you've only got to visit the place to see plenty of examples of early hominids still living.....

[pabird]

No worry about hornchurch as soon as they discover the wheel they!ll be catching neanderthal in a flash

Walking upright does appear a longer term problem

Mind you it is normally a Saturday night late when I visit

[Uncle Urchin]

is that when you're out stalking the good folk of havering then pabird....

 

I hope you aint started all the raincoat stuff again....naughty naughty.... <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

[American FLEET FAN No1]

I wanted to be an Athiest........but i was told i wouldn't get any Holi(y)days.........

[pabird]

Have to Unc all the havering thugs are in brentwood high street on a saturday night doing their benifits