Fixtures Tue 7th/Wed 8th October

[duncs]

Thanks for the nice comments Weeble.

 

Duncs, let's set the record straight.....

November 2011 Chertsey lose their manager, their whole budget, their whole team. Find themselves in a league that is suddenly way too big for their resources. Myself and Ian Selley were offered to take over as joint managers which we accepted. Two weeks later Ian Selley resigns for his own reasons. I manage to keep the club at step 4 for 2 seasons but sadly resources ran out and we succumbed to relegation last season.

During this time not only did I pick up valuable management experience for the future and how a football club is run, but I also continued playing at step 4. This is experience gained at step 4 that a lot of managers have never had nor will ever have. I am very thankful to Chertsey for that opportunity. Yes I could have said no but it was an opportunity many managers might never get. I was lucky and I'm very glad I did it.

Fair play to you but i for one couldn't understand why they allowed you to continue as the manager,not digging at you personally cos if it had been someone else i would of said the same,if as you say you were playing at step 4 then thats where your contacts have to be or from levels above,i have played in Ryman Prem and Ryman south but my contacts are  CCL players therefore i wouldn't try to manage in Ryman,its all about contacts in non league and of course a healthy budget gets you more contacts,NL1 nothing beats playing i have won quite a few cups  as a manager and although its a good feeling its not the same as being a player

[johnnojudo]

Fair play to you but i for one couldn't understand why they allowed you to continue as the manager,not digging at you personally cos if it had been someone else i would of said the same,if as you say you were playing at step 4 then thats where your contacts have to be or from levels above,i have played in Ryman Prem and Ryman south but my contacts are  CCL players therefore i wouldn't try to manage in Ryman,its all about contacts in non league and of course a healthy budget gets you more contacts,NL1 nothing beats playing i have won quite a few cups  as a manager and although its a good feeling its not the same as being a player

 

And why would they not allow me to continue as manager Duncs??

 

I had plenty of contacts at step 4 or above. I had a Farnborough manager willing to loan me players. I had 3 ryman prem and ryman south managers regularly offering loans or players not quite fitting into their squad. I had email after email from decent proven step 4 players wanting to sign at the club.......

 

What I didnt have was the money available to sign or keep them, or a decent pitch to attract them or keep them. Out of all the clubs in the Southern Central League, Chertsey did the most travelling as we were geographically, the Southern most club. Why would a player sign for Chertsey for £20-30, train twice a week, play on a below standard pitch, and then travel 115 miles to play at Rugby, Daventry, St Ives??? They wouldnt !! But i had a very committed group of players that played for the supporters at Chertsey, played for each other, and I hope played for me too.

Over the 3 seasons, i had a core of players that were dedicated to the club. Many other players came and gone. A few players that were committed to me were understandably drawn away by better clubs such as Tommy Mcgarry who went to Farnborough, Tom O'Regan (Beaconsfield and now Burnham), Michael Blount (Slough), Jamie Norris (Egham), Andy Crossley (Godalming), Ryan Blake (Kingstonian). All of these players are now playing at the same level or higher, and they all moved on for either money, a decent pitch, their careers, or a combination. I couldnt offer any of these and I wished them luck.

 

As you can see Duncs...its not all what it seems from the outside. 

[duncs]

And why would they not allow me to continue as manager Duncs??

 

I had plenty of contacts at step 4 or above. I had a Farnborough manager willing to loan me players. I had 3 ryman prem and ryman south managers regularly offering loans or players not quite fitting into their squad. I had email after email from decent proven step 4 players wanting to sign at the club.......

 

What I didnt have was the money available to sign or keep them, or a decent pitch to attract them or keep them. Out of all the clubs in the Southern Central League, Chertsey did the most travelling as we were geographically, the Southern most club. Why would a player sign for Chertsey for £20-30, train twice a week, play on a below standard pitch, and then travel 115 miles to play at Rugby, Daventry, St Ives??? They wouldnt !! But i had a very committed group of players that played for the supporters at Chertsey, played for each other, and I hope played for me too.

Over the 3 seasons, i had a core of players that were dedicated to the club. Many other players came and gone. A few players that were committed to me were understandably drawn away by better clubs such as Tommy Mcgarry who went to Farnborough, Tom O'Regan (Beaconsfield and now Burnham), Michael Blount (Slough), Jamie Norris (Egham), Andy Crossley (Godalming), Ryan Blake (Kingstonian). All of these players are now playing at the same level or higher, and they all moved on for either money, a decent pitch, their careers, or a combination. I couldnt offer any of these and I wished them luck.

 

As you can see Duncs...its not all what it seems from the outside. 

thats all well and good jonno but you've forgotten one thing......... results,i think your style of management untill it is honed suits a lower league,nothing wrong with that cos thats where we all learn,its never easy going into senior management from nowhere it nearly always is disastrous for the individual and the club as has been your experience,you said you would like to continue in management at some stage, are you sure it is right for you ? 

[Chris Clapham]

Vale 1 up at Guildford 37 minutes

[johnnojudo]

thats all well and good jonno but you've forgotten one thing......... results,i think your style of management untill it is honed suits a lower league,nothing wrong with that cos thats where we all learn,its never easy going into senior management from nowhere it nearly always is disastrous for the individual and the club as has been your experience,you said you would like to continue in management at some stage, are you sure it is right for you ?

What do you know about my style of management Duncs?? Please explain how you 'think' I manage? And how it's suited to lower level?

And please don't patronise me. Becoming Chertsey manager wasn't disastrous in any shape or form for me or the football club.

 

Id like to think you were on the wined up as your usual poor banter is showcased here but I'd expect a bit of common courtesy as we've known each other a long time.

[duncs]

I wasn't patronising you don't flatter yourself i was giving you a bit of advice initially,which was to carry on playing and leave the management till later or to those who know what they are doing.

[TRS]

What do you know about my style of management Duncs?? Please explain how you 'think' I manage? And how it's suited to lower level?

And please don't patronise me. Becoming Chertsey manager wasn't disastrous in any shape or form for me or the football club.

 

Id like to think you were on the wined up as your usual poor banter is showcased here but I'd expect a bit of common courtesy as we've known each other a long time.

 

I thought duncs was tee-total?

[duncs]

did you mean tea total Trev or are you winding me up ha ha ha

[Chris Clapham]

FT - Guildford City 0-1 RPV

[johnnojudo]

Do you know what patronising means??

 

Your advice had no substance or I would have taken it in.

Yes I agree but already knew it..... 'Play for as long as you can cos you're a long time retired'.

I know the saying and totally agree! Difference is Duncs, at Chertsey I was in the unique position of being able to play and be the manager still. And before you say it.... You can't manage and play!!! Yes you can especially if you have good back room staff which I've had. If my budget at Ctfc allowed me to stretch over 16 players, manager, asst manager, gk coach, Physio, Physio supplies, I wouldn't have needed to play.

Last season, Weeble and I so very nearly picked up an investor who would have tripled the budget nearly. If this had happened, I wouldn't have played cos the class of player I could have afforded would have been enough. Sadly it didn't happen so I played and also saved money.

As I said before, an opportunity arose & I grabbed it with both hands. I don't regret it at all.

It's now on my cv that I managed a step 4 team. I have very good contacts at step 3,4 & 5 now. I have learnt in the space of 3 years what someone might only learn in 6-7 yrs potentially. I wouldn't have done that if it wasn't for me taking a chance with Chertsey.

Have you managed, coached or picked up bottles at step 4??

I have. And I will again I'm sure when the time is right for me.

[duncs]

Do you know what patronising means??

 

Your advice had no substance or I would have taken it in.

Yes I agree but already knew it..... 'Play for as long as you can cos you're a long time retired'.

I know the saying and totally agree! Difference is Duncs, at Chertsey I was in the unique position of being able to play and be the manager still. And before you say it.... You can't manage and play!!! Yes you can especially if you have good back room staff which I've had. If my budget at Ctfc allowed me to stretch over 16 players, manager, asst manager, gk coach, Physio, Physio supplies, I wouldn't have needed to play.

Last season, Weeble and I so very nearly picked up an investor who would have tripled the budget nearly. If this had happened, I wouldn't have played cos the class of player I could have afforded would have been enough. Sadly it didn't happen so I played and also saved money.

As I said before, an opportunity arose & I grabbed it with both hands. I don't regret it at all.

It's now on my cv that I managed a step 4 team. I have very good contacts at step 3,4 & 5 now. I have learnt in the space of 3 years what someone might only learn in 6-7 yrs potentially. I wouldn't have done that if it wasn't for me taking a chance with Chertsey.

Have you managed, coached or picked up bottles at step 4??

I have. And I will again I'm sure when the time is right for me.

You've lost me, every club has a story from every player when a team is relegated about why they had a sh1t season and blames everyone but themselves,who did you have as backroom staff ?And i wouldn't mention on your CV anything about your previous,i disagree completely about being a player manager from experience and like you have proved it does not work.and as i said before i have no contacts at step 4 so no i haven't managed at that level,but i have managed at step 5 and won quite a lot,surely thats the better thing to do.

Edited October 8, 2014 by duncs

[johnnojudo]

Oh my!

 

Why did you get replaced at Cove??? Was it anything else other than not good enough??

[duncs]

Oh my!

 

Why did you get replaced at Cove??? Was it anything else other than not good enough??

Thats right and thats why i was surprised that you had such a long run in charge at Chertsey,thats football management jonno thats how it has to be otherwise clubs get relegated and fall into lower league football,look at where cove are now and where Chertsey are.

[duncs]

Oh my!

 

Why did you get replaced at Cove??? Was it anything else other than not good enough??

This tells me a lot about your man management skills

[Chris Clapham]

                           

[johnnojudo]

Man management cannot be judged on a sentence Duncs. You do talk some shit.

 

Chertsey are at the level they need to be. I'm not going to divulge in details of their finances but another season trying to compete at step 4 would have crippled the club beyond repair. Chertsey were promoted under a false position.

[Beano]

Chertsey are at the level they need to be. I'm not going to divulge in details of their finances but another season trying to compete at step 4 would have crippled the club beyond repair. Chertsey were promoted under a false position.

 

To expand on that and answer Chris Clapham's plea to bring this discussion vaguely back onto the topic of midweek results, I wonder if Chertsey are quite where they need to be. I appreciate that the Southern Combination Cup is not always an especially reliable indicator of a team's form, but averaging only a point per game after a quarter of the season is not the form of "9/2 title favourites", as Chris had them in pre-season and a 5-1 defeat in a local derby is hardly a springboard to greater things.

 

When a team gets relegated, of course the management and players have to take the lion's share of responsibility for that, but they aren't the only ones. When Ashford Town (Middlesex) went down last season, a decision was taken to change the manager and statistically, things got worse before they got better. However, you can prove whatever you like with stats and football is not just about results, even if they are the most important thing. Performances got better and so did the spirit within the club. Had the change been made a few weeks earlier, who knows what would have happened?

 

However, the change didn't happen earlier because the manager at that time was and is an absolute legend at the club and the Board (which included myself, at that time) was desperate for him to turn it around. That decision to give him time, ultimately, was wrong and therefore those involved (including me) should take a share of responsibility for the consequences.

 

However, because the change was made, Ashford have been able to hit the ground running at their new level and, in the few games I've seen, have played some superb football with a good, young team led by a bright, young manager. The club will enjoy its second spell in the CCL and if it is fortunate to return to Step 4 in the future, it will do so stronger for having come down.

 

As to the argument for and against younger coaches, I think that, increasingly, you will see people going into coaching instead of playing, rather than after a playing career. The game has changed and I think it's moving into an era when coaching is seen as increasingly important, rather than something you do when you can't compete on the park anymore. Playing experience is still vital in some ways, but as is being proved all over the place, you can be an effective manager or coach without it.

[NonLeague i]

Before this was hijacked by trash talking!! I just feel that for some players who cant reach higher leagues with their playing ability that going into coaching/management is a valid option earlier rather then later. Weeble in noway did i take what you said as being rude and i appreciate what your saying but my point was playing at a lower level winning things doesnt carry the same feeling as winning as a manager at a much higher level. Maybe we can agree to disagree on that.Younger staff tend to have better relationships with players judging from what you see with AVB, Guardiola, Gary Monk etc etc. With age im guessing the argument would be do they get respected by the senior players?.. Well infact i believe respect is gained in football by your personality and actions/results NOT age. Many "older" managers play outdated football that is steady and consistent but will not win you titles. Styles of football change like the tides and as such a younger manager with new ideas are refreshing and work. Duncs as much as maybe you were on a "wind up" will anyone know someones management style unless there sitting in the dressing room listening to whats being said? Im not johnnos biggest fan HOWEVER he did steady a sinking ship and really cant see where your views about doing a bad job come from?

[E&E Rich]

Our Match Report from the narrow win over Mole Valley SCR is here:

 

http://www.eefconline.co.uk/LCN121.html

[duncs]

The thing is NL1 i could come on here and say jonno you are talking sh1t but my powers of argument are fact based,this all started because i advised him to carry on playing and wait for the management thing to happen when he has finished playing,he took umbrage to me giving him advice and started slinging mud so i responded,whats wrong with that ?Do you know who his backroom team was cos he don't seem to want to answer me on that one.i'm fed up with fecking kids telling me they're are always right and i am always wrong bunch of winless kents.