Promotion/PPG

[E&E Rich]

I wonder why they've done that. They even beat the Champions Dereham last week on their own patch.

 

Excellent news for Guernsey, Redhill and maybe even Barkingside too.

[HKP]

What is confirmed is that Step 4 need 16 teams promoted from Step 5 in order for the FA to achieve their plan. Only 12 of the 14 Step 5 League can provide candidates. The FA have also stated that additional teams required to fill those Step 4 places will be taken from 2nd placed teams in 7 Leagues that feed the Ryman catchment area. Only 5 of those 7 Leagues can provide a 2nd placed team. GFC need to be one of the top 4 of those 5. GFC require just 2 more points to achieve just that. 

 

Ok thanks for that.

[ormering]

Great news for us. Fred, Bommie and GF, you are mines of information. Don't think I'll be taking anything for granted till I see it in print from the FA mind. REALLY looking forward to this weekend now. Could be a lot of fun now eh, HKP?

[GuernseyGeordie]

Great news for us. Fred, Bommie and GF, you are mines of information. Don't think I'll be taking anything for granted till I see it in print from the FA mind. REALLY looking forward to this weekend now. Could be a lot of fun now eh, HKP?

I'm up for a few Friday too. We could pick our team of the year, and see who we can slot in after the first seventeen GFC players......

[jaygsy]

and see who we can slot in after the first seventeen GFC players......

 

Love it  go green lions!!

[VPCTFC]

 

If Redhill lose their big game at East Preston on Saturday, then the most they can get is 90 points, or PPG 2.143, which means firstly that Wisbech would then be promoted, and that Guernsey would then only require 90 points for promotion as they have a better GD than Redhill, who would also probably then finish behind the non-applying East Preston in third but I don't know whether it is ppg or league position that is the tie breaker with the FA. VPCTFC any clues?

 

 

 

Could be either. One section of the rules says that it's based on ppg of the clubs the leagues have nominated so whether they've finished second or third appears to be irrelevant but another section says 'clubs finishing in second place will be ranked...' and doesn't mention the third placed teams at all.

My wonderful (incompetent) employers work like this - they reword one section of something but forget another section is tied into it and that gets left with the old wording.

[HKP]

Taken from the GFC facebook page.

 

 

Promotion Clarification: A team achieving 2nd place in a Step 5 can be promoted and it's dependant on the amount of points accumulated in relation to the amount of games that the team has played and how that compares to other teams in other leagues at Guernsey FC's level. Therefore, Guernsey FC has to achieve as many points as possible this weekend in its push for promotion. Two 2nd placed teams at Step 5 are guaranteed promotion and then it's up to the English FA to discuss whether other teams are promoted.

 

 

[Green_Fingers]

Taken from the GFC facebook page.

Just ask yourself the simple question, how will the FA achieve their stated aims of promoting 16 Step 5 Clubs to Step 4 whilst relegating the bottom Clubs from that level. All then becomes clearer.

[HKP]

Totally agree, the club are I guess understandby are being cautious and playing the FA line...

[Green_Fingers]

Totally agree, the club are I guess understandby are being cautious and playing the FA line...

In which case 12 points guarantees a place in the top 2 second places (10 points only gives you joint 2nd and the FA haven't stated they'll look at GD to separate teams on identical ppg.) No pressure then - 4 wins it is 

[VPCTFC]

Just ask yourself the simple question, how will the FA achieve their stated aims of promoting 16 Step 5 Clubs to Step 4 whilst relegating the bottom Clubs from that level. All then becomes clearer.

 

All the official stuff from the FA says there will be 14 teams promoted. The latest mention I know of is from October when the FA put the step 4 application form online.

 

"With regard to promotion at the end of this season, in order for the Isthmian league Step 4 divisions to increase to 24 clubs each, there will be 14 clubs promoted.  The clubs finishing in the top position in their current Step 5 league and be in possession of a Grade E by 31 March 2013 will be eligible for promotion.  In the event of the first placed club not being eligible, the clubs finishing in second or third position can be considered subject the clubs being in possession of a Grade E by 31 March 2013 however this cannot be guaranteed. "

 

http://www.thefa.com/Leagues/NationalLeagueSystem/NewsAndFeatures/2012/promotion-to-step-4-2012-13

 

There will only be 12 step 5 leagues promoting sides using the new promotion rules so the 'if vacancies still exist' bit comes in with two leagues promoting a second club this season only. That's my reading of it.

You have to bear in mind that, in the past, the rules have said 12 up from the 14 step 5 leagues. When there have been 13 eligible clubs they have still only promoted 12 despite giving reprieves at step 4. As of this season it's 14 up. Assuming they operate the same way they always have, they won't promote more than 14 and will reprieve at step 4.

Edited May 3, 2013 by VPCTFC

[Green_Fingers]

 

All the official stuff from the FA says there will be 14 teams promoted. The latest mention I know of is from October when the FA put the step 4 application form online.

 

"With regard to promotion at the end of this season, in order for the Isthmian league Step 4 divisions to increase to 24 clubs each, there will be 14 clubs promoted.  The clubs finishing in the top position in their current Step 5 league and be in possession of a Grade E by 31 March 2013 will be eligible for promotion.  In the event of the first placed club not being eligible, the clubs finishing in second or third position can be considered subject the clubs being in possession of a Grade E by 31 March 2013 however this cannot be guaranteed. "

 

http://www.thefa.com/Leagues/NationalLeagueSystem/NewsAndFeatures/2012/promotion-to-step-4-2012-13

 

There will only be 12 step 5 leagues promoting sides using the new promotion rules so the 'if vacancies still exist' bit comes in with two leagues promoting a second club this season only. That's my reading of it.

You have to bear in mind that, in the past, the rules have said 12 up from the 14 step 5 leagues. When there have been 13 eligible clubs they have still only promoted 12 despite giving reprieves at step 4. As of this season it's 14 up. Assuming they operate the same way they always have, they won't promote more than 14 and will reprieve at step 4.

I think that was just another FA typo VP. The maths don't add up. If they want 4 extra teams at Step 4 and want 6 relegated then 16 have to come up from Step 5. If they only promote 14 then it must always have been their intention to reprieve 2

[VPCTFC]

It may well be a typo but it's repeated in the FA handbook.

 

This all came about because of the step 5 / 6 review. As well as relegating the bottom step 4 clubs they also said step 5 leagues must have between 20 and 22 teams next season. Does this mean wholesale changes at this level around the country that we're unaware of? We all know the Hellenic, Kent and Essex are short on numbers but the Northern League has too many due to getting two down this season and not promoting any. It'll be interesting to see if this policy is carried through.

They also said clubs relegated and promoted between steps 5 and 6 would be pooled and allocated to leagues by the FA rather than automatically stay in the same league. If they follow this through then the bottom three in the Premier Division will be relegated no matter what.

 

I'd love to be a fly on the wall at the FA meeting next week.

[Green_Fingers]

Yep, that's where it all started last May with the FA boldly declaring that extra Clubs would be given the opportunity to be promoted from Step 5 to Step 4 fro season 2013/14. Lets see how far they can back-track from that position over the next couple of weeks   

 

 

Press Release recd today from Mike Appleby : 

PRESS RELEASE

NATIONAL LEAGUE SYSTEM STEP 5 REVIEW

At a meeting of the Football Association Leagues Committee held today at Wembley Stadium the Final Report from the Step 5/6 Review Group, containing a number of recommendations was considered. 

By way of background, the Review Group was established by the Leagues Committee in 2011 to look at a possible reduction in the number of Step 5 divisions from 14 to 12 for the commencement of season 2013/2014. Following an initial meeting with all competitions in July 2011 there followed an extensive consultation period during which all Step 5/6 competitions were met on an individual basis to seek their views on this matter. The initial remit of the Group was altered to take into account the feedback from these meetings. In the early part of 2012 the Group held a series of meetings to which all Step 5 leagues, their member clubs and County Football Associations were invited to consider the suggestion for change. 

As a result of these meetings the Review Group, taking into account both the feedback from the discussions and correspondence received, complied their Final Report and the following recommendations were agreed by the Leagues Committee today.

• That the process of reducing Step 5 leagues from 14 to 12 was deemed unworkable and the initial suggestion withdrawn.

• That, in order to continue to compete at Step 5 of the National League System, ALL clubs must meet the National Ground Grading Category F in FULLby 31 March 2013. Clubs that do not meet these requirements WILL be relegated to an appropriate Step 6 division/competition.

In addition all Leagues must fully comply with the Regulations for the Establishment and Operation of the National League System, Standardised Rules and National Ground Grading Document.

• That all Step 5 divisions must have a minimum of 20 clubs with a maximum of 22 clubs from the commencement of season 2013/2014.

· That the Leagues Committee would, in future, in conjunction with the appropriate leagues, manage the promotion/relegation process between Step 5 and Step 6 and that as from the end of season 2012/2013 clubs would be placed into “feeder pools” and allocated the most appropriate geographical division. 

· That, with effect from Season 2013/2014, the Premier Divisions of the Isthmian, Northern Premier and Southern Football Leagues (Step 3) be increased to 24 clubs. 

· That, with effect from Season 2013/2014 and in order to create 14 relegation places at Step 4, the Isthmian League Division 1 North and Division 1 South (Step 4) be increased to 24 clubs with each relegating 3 clubs to Step 5, subject to any club issues arising during or after the completion of the playing season. It was noted that the Northern Premier and Southern Leagues have no desire to increase to 24 clubs for their Step 4 divisions. This will mean that a number of additional clubs will be given the opportunity to be promoted from Step 5 to Step 4 for season 2013/2014, the process is to be agreed. 

In future seasons, to stimulate promotion, consideration would be given to clubs that finish in 1st, 2nd or 3rd positions in Step 5 competitions provided that they meet the entry criteria for Step 4. There would, however, be only one club promoted from any Step 5 competition in any season. In addition, it was agreed that at the conclusion of Season 2012/2013 the clubs finishing in bottom position in each of the Step 4 divisions would be relegated. 

· It was further agreed that discussions should take place with all leagues to look at the possibility that, regardless of any vacancies occurring, the club finishing in the bottom positions in divisions at Steps 1 to 5 of the National League System will be relegated. 

· That there remained issues to be addressed at Step 6, not least in the Essex area, and these will be progressed in the coming months. 


Review Group wished to place on record their thanks to all those leagues, clubs, County Football Associations and others that had contributed in any way to the consultation process. 



Mike Appleby 
Leagues & Clubs Manager 
On behalf of the Leagues Committee 
May 2012

 

[Chris Clapham]

Guernsey promoted already???? - https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AqII2SlGRhT7dHIwSUdacDRlaDV3VkNsSjc3UVdqWnc#gid=0

[Green_Fingers]

Indeed Chris, but GFC have adopted a "belt & braces" approach as various FA documents state that only 14 Clubs will definitely be promoted. If true, to be one of those 14 they need to win both of their remaining fixtures as by dropping 2 points they would only equal Aylesbury in the ppg table and the FA haven't stated that it then goes to goal difference (which would make sense but since when are the FA sensible?)

[VPCTFC]

There are definitely 14 going up from step 5, probably 16 and maybe 17. If I was a betting man I'd put my money on 16 but it wouldn't surprise me if it turned out to be 14. 17 would surprise me so I reckon Barkingside are staying down.

[VPCTFC]

Guernsey won 2-0 today so a win tomorrow will absolutely, definitely see them promoted. A draw or defeat and it's wait and see what happens......

[queues]

the lads are shattered, but have come so far, in such difficult circumstances, so tomorrow is a cup final day and only a win will do

 

then there will be no if and buts from the men in blazers

[GuernseyGeordie]

the lads are shattered, but have come so far, in such difficult circumstances, so tomorrow is a cup final day and only a win will do

 

then there will be no if and buts from the men in blazers

As the best team in this league we certainly deserve it. No chickens being counted here though.