Step 5 Restructuring

[Chris Clapham]

there is always the bus smudge, that don't cost you anything!

 

 

[Jurg78]

The F.A.relent Kroons,do you really think they give a damn about Step 5 Clubs.All this was done for was to make it easier for them,as 14 into 12 did not go.Step 4 Clubs will look after their own,2 promotion places from Step 5 is not even on the agenda as part of this reorginization,in fact the said proposals take away a Promotion place from Southern Clubs.Tell me where all this money is going to come from for the Clubs to get their grounds up to scratch,supporters numbers will dwindle further due to increased travel costs.Non of this concerns the F.A.all they are interested in is T.V. Money not the good of the game.

 

What a load of nonsense! Just how many people travel to away games in the CCL - Committee Members and Pass Holders excepted? Very, very few.

 

Beano is absolutely right. There has to be movement on promotion from Step 5 but I won't be holding my breath. How long did it take the FA etc to fiinally grant automatic promotion from the top of the Non League pyramid to the fourth division of the Football League?

 

No doubt there will be much debate, discussion and b/s in the months to come.

 

Resent your remarks regards only Pass Holders,and Committee Members are the only ones who travel to away games,I happen to travel to watch games away.I pay to get in too,and have been known to have a few drinks as well as something to eat.But will I pay £33.20p to get to Deal,£28.90p to Canterbury,£27.80 to get to Herne Bay,when currently I can pay £12.10p to Sandhurst and Farnborough,£12.40p to get to Farnham,and £9.10p to get to your beloved Windsor.Rather go and watch Reading,like another poster I know!!!!!

 

He doesn't say that though Smudge. He say's other than these people, very few others travel as away support, which is true in the CCL.

There are very few clubs that have an away following of "supporters" that aren't connected to the club in some way, whether it be in an official capacity or through association with player(s).

[Chris Clapham]

I am sure local groundhoppers to us will look forward to seeing some different clubs at Wibbandune.

I think Smudge has a fair point re the extra travelling cost to supporters. I don't drive and I go by train to away matches so that will add to the cost of my day out appreciably!

[bomaya]

I think Windsor have the most away support in the CCL from the teams I've seen so far this season.

 

Back to the topic, I am glad it is finally raising debate this issue. So many people reacting with shock and anger across various leagues which is odd as this has been rumoured for ages now...we even talked about it on here some time back but maybe people thought it wasn't going to happen.

 

I hope if leagues and their member clubs don't like this proposal, they do actually stand up and fight it rather than taking it meekly. Or even better, come up with some alternatives. After all 14 may not go nicely in 12 but 24 does....

[Smudge]

Even if you do drive,those costs must increase for sure.My own take on this,for what it is worth,as money does not seem a problem to most who post on here.F.A.to instruct all Step 5 Clubs,that they must have a ground grading for Step 4 to compete at Step 5,else they will be demoted to Step 6.

[Chris Clapham]

Even if you do drive,those costs must increase for sure.My own take on this,for what it is worth,as money does not seem a problem to most who post on here.F.A.to instruct all Step 5 Clubs,that they must have a ground grading for Step 4 to compete at Step 5,else they will be demoted to Step 6.

 

That would upset a LOT of clubs Smudge.

[Smudge]

It would indeed Chris,but my take on Non League is that all Clubs are individuals,the only time they could all come together is in a case like this,maybe if they all united as 1 voice and stuck together,they could defeat the F.A.'s Plans.But alas this will not happen I fear.

[Krooner]

Even if you do drive,those costs must increase for sure.My own take on this,for what it is worth,as money does not seem a problem to most who post on here.F.A.to instruct all Step 5 Clubs,that they must have a ground grading for Step 4 to compete at Step 5,else they will be demoted to Step 6.

 

Make up you mind Ground Grading was going to kill clubs and now you are suggesting they all have to do more work ?

[FSB]

As Manager of Horley Town FC in the CCL this is also of great interest to me.

 

I have done some mileage calculations based on the current make up of the CCL and the proposed new league based on the teams currently in SCL 1 and CCL premier.

 

Even allowing for the addition of 2 more teams (CCL currently 22, proposed league 24) our average return journey will drop from 56.7 to 42.9 miles almost 14 miles per trip. Over the season this is this equates to about 200 miles less travelled (you have to do 2 more trips).

 

This obviously will mean less travel costs for some CCL teams in the proposed set up which could make it more attractive.

 

Ali

Edited January 12, 2012 by FSB

[Smudge]

Exactly the point Ali,so thats a yes from Horley then,why you were not in the Sussex League already amazes me.That is why the F.a. will always win at no cost to them,it's called divide and Rule.

[FSB]

To be honest Smudge the feeling around the club is that people would much prefer to be in the CCL. Facilities are better and whilst journeys are shorter they are on smaller roads.

 

In the 5 years i have been involved with the CCL we have only once been delayed on the M25 and we still got there in time to get changed and warmed up. (But then i insist on early meets, my players just love it!!)

Edited January 12, 2012 by FSB

[Big J R]

We had long discussions on this last night before and after our cup tie.

Some of our players (and Dorking's) arrived at our ground after 6.30pm due to work commitments and they flagged this as their only real concern re travelling longer distances. Getting time off work for earlier departures will be difficult for everyone.

There is a level of expectency (not quite excitement) about visiting new clubs but it will be sad to lose some of our current opponents.

I think the whole mind set will need to change at CWUFC and this will be reflected in the calibre (and maybe quality) of player required in 2013.

It is pretty obvious that we will have to subsidise further the players travelling costs/expenses.

Quite where that extra cash will come from is unclear at present!!!

 

Of course we will have the option to "opt out" at step 5; I hope that doesn't happen!

 

A great post, Chris !! You will be awareafter yesterday evening, that none of our supporters, (well, maybe one or two on occasions), travel to away games.

 

The proof of the pudding in the end, will be down to the clubs themselves. There's a very old adage, that 'people can vote with their feet', or in this case not to use them and do a David Cameron !!

 

Monsiuer Sarkasticky and Mrs Murky now understand the words 'NON' and 'NINE'

Edited January 12, 2012 by Big J R

[E&E Rich]

Let's be honest here, we'd all like to see our clubs progress to Step Four or higher if possible. In those circumstances travelling would increase, so this is just preparation. Yes costs will increase a little, but remember it's the same for all other clubs at this level, not just in our league.

 

We also knew or at least hoped that the FA would one day sort out Step 5 and now that day has come, so that is good news. We now know that reorganisation will happen. That is a certainty and we need to just put up with it.

 

The real problem here as I mentioned earlier and Beano referred to is relating to an extra promotion place. It is the only argument that in my opinion we actually CAN win.

 

Why it is that very good step five clubs in recent years like Chertsey, Camberley, Molesey, Hanworth Villa and Guildford have to queue up one at a time to replace the like of Walton Casuals, Horsham YMCAs, Faversham, Corinthian Casuals, Whitstable and Eastbourne Town I don't know.

 

It is worth remembering that there are more Step Five clubs than in all four of the steps above put together. If we pool our resources at the meetings and raise a message loud and clear that 280 Step Five clubs do not deserve this logjam (nice word Beano) and that four down, two up is not only fair but necessary to stop many clubs at this level stagnating or folding, then maybe the F.A. will factor in something sooner than later. If we bang on about anything else it will muddy the waters and will diminish our case, so we must raise this as our ONLY point of dissent at this meeting.

 

In the long term it is the only issue that really matters.

[Smudge]

Bit unfair in that post E&E,do not think Walton Casuals,Whitstable,Faversham,Eastbourne Town,have ever been reprieved.Horsham Y.M.C.A got demoted to the Sussex League Step 5. and of course Corinthian Casuals have been reprieved in the past.

Edited January 12, 2012 by Smudge

[Don't Blame Me]

Nail hit on the head E&E Ed. There are a number of clubs at Step 4 who are there to make up the numbers and are in a lovely little comfort zone knowing that relegation to Step 5 is as likely as Britain joining the Euro. If the clubs / leagues at Step 5 joined forces and pushed for 2 up from each league then this can only be a good thing. There are at least 7 or 8 clubs in the CCLP who could easily be competitive at Step 4.

 

Beano is our Leader

[Green_Fingers]

Would be interesting to hear views of contributors from Step 4 Clubs as to the relative strengths of the 2 levels. Ed above clearly believes that 2nd placed Step 5 teams are "better" than 4th bottom Step 4 - is that a view shared by those with Step 4 experiences?

 

Whilst most promoted Step 5 teams "hold their own" at the higher level, it's never with the same players and often a virtual new squad is needed to survive at the higher level?

[Jeff Hamnett TSF]

dorking fc has a huge away support.

 

 

 

 

 

( select your next witticism very carefully Mr BJR, it may be your last!)

[Smudge]

The level of Step 4 Clubs at Ryman is dropping year by year,a bit like the Premiership.All down to money,some C.C.L. Clubs have bigger budgets than many Ryman Clubs.

[bomaya]

Bit unfair in that post E&E,do not think Walton Casuals,Whitstable,Faversham,Eastbourne Town,have ever been reprieved.Horsham Y.M.C.A got demoted to the Sussex League Step 5. and of course Corinthian Casuals have been reprieved in the past.

 

Walton Casuals finished 21st in 2009/2010 but they stayed up.

[Don't Blame Me]

And some CCL clubs attract more spectators than Ryman clubs. I have seen Romford twice this season. In the FA Cup against Royston Town they were nothing to get excited about. Against Redbridge they were worse. Talking of crowds at Redbridge, for a recent home game they attracted 40. I think that it is much harder for Ryman clubs to be competitive because of the proliferation of professional clubs in London.

 

Windsor, Camberley, Guildford and Hanworth Villa all average in excess of 90 per home league game. Horley may fall into this group but I don't have the numbers.

 

The hardest thing for a lot of non league clubs is to get the willing volunteers to do the work behind the scenes.