Referees Reports

[Smudge]

Sorry to repeat myself, but page 169 of CCFL Handbook give a really detailed explanation of referee scoring, and any experienced club sec should be fully aware of the process and method. One tip - mark the referee on day following game. This should give you more space for a properly considered opinion, minus the emotion. Realise there is no way we can get to the bottom of this particular case via the Forum, but if I were your club sec I would have asked for an explanation. My experience of dealing with CCFL management has generally been positive - providiing you approach the subject in a reasonable manner. As I said before, there is more to this that we know about.

 

 

 

Can olny answer re the Suburban FL but woud expect its the same in all leagues

 

There is no fee for the referees report form as one has to be sent to the referees manager after every game within two working days by both clubs and these are done by emai now

I would think the fine is for the ate arrival of the form

 

The committee are advised when the remarks are really bad, and the mark is very very low, and if the referee gets low marks from both teams, the referee is then asked for his comments off the game by the referees manager If the committee feels that the referee needs looking at , a member of the committee is at his next game, and if a level 4 referee, an assessor will also be there If the committee also wish, a report from both assistant referees is also requested if a major incident has occured during a game

 

If the report is based on just one incident, ie a penalty in the last minute given or not given, the referees manager will write back to the club advising them that more comments regarding the whole game is required, and not just the one incident and also the page in the handbook which gives help on marking the referees

 

 

Middleman quotes:-'mark the Referee on the following day' ,what and risk a Fine for late arrival.My own personal dealings with the C.C.L. Lead me to believe that they are all about the rules, never answer a question.Re:- Younghammerwhitby,3 weeks ago spoke to Alan Constable re this matter,nothing has changed,no meeting has taken place.Likewise Surrey F.A.,yhw Was told to ring Cobham Management and Committee Members by Caroline McRoyal which he did,with 1 reply from Damian Ray.Today I spoke to the new Surrey F.A. welfare officer,Mr.Frank Thompson who said he would contact Y.H.W by the end of the week,after he had made his enquiries.But I would bet they THE C.C.L. have FINED KNAPHILL for breaking the rules,that moneys already in the BANK.DISGRACEFUL!!!!!!!NO MONEY IN IT WHY DO IT.

[MiddleMan]

Mr Smudge - referee report forms need to be submitted within 48 hours and are processed on-line, so completing the form following day is a non-issue. Believe me, immediatley following a game is not usually the best time to make a considered judgement! And to our colleague at Guildford, confirm this debate has nothing at all to do with the events of last Saturday. Again - there is no such thing as a fine for a properly completed report form sent within the time frame.

 

 

 

 

Sorry to repeat myself, but page 169 of CCFL Handbook give a really detailed explanation of referee scoring, and any experienced club sec should be fully aware of the process and method. One tip - mark the referee on day following game. This should give you more space for a properly considered opinion, minus the emotion. Realise there is no way we can get to the bottom of this particular case via the Forum, but if I were your club sec I would have asked for an explanation. My experience of dealing with CCFL management has generally been positive - providiing you approach the subject in a reasonable manner. As I said before, there is more to this that we know about.

 

 

 

Can olny answer re the Suburban FL but woud expect its the same in all leagues

 

There is no fee for the referees report form as one has to be sent to the referees manager after every game within two working days by both clubs and these are done by emai now

I would think the fine is for the ate arrival of the form

 

The committee are advised when the remarks are really bad, and the mark is very very low, and if the referee gets low marks from both teams, the referee is then asked for his comments off the game by the referees manager If the committee feels that the referee needs looking at , a member of the committee is at his next game, and if a level 4 referee, an assessor will also be there If the committee also wish, a report from both assistant referees is also requested if a major incident has occured during a game

 

If the report is based on just one incident, ie a penalty in the last minute given or not given, the referees manager will write back to the club advising them that more comments regarding the whole game is required, and not just the one incident and also the page in the handbook which gives help on marking the referees

 

 

Middleman quotes:-'mark the Referee on the following day' ,what and risk a Fine for late arrival.My own personal dealings with the C.C.L. Lead me to believe that they are all about the rules, never answer a question.Re:- Younghammerwhitby,3 weeks ago spoke to Alan Constable re this matter,nothing has changed,no meeting has taken place.Likewise Surrey F.A.,yhw Was told to ring Cobham Management and Committee Members by Caroline McRoyal which he did,with 1 reply from Damian Ray.Today I spoke to the new Surrey F.A. welfare officer,Mr.Frank Thompson who said he would contact Y.H.W by the end of the week,after he had made his enquiries.But I would bet they THE C.C.L. have FINED KNAPHILL for breaking the rules,that moneys already in the BANK.DISGRACEFUL!!!!!!!NO MONEY IN IT WHY DO IT.

[catweazle]

- the comments made are constructive and not offensive or personal in nature, nor based on one single decision over the course of 90 mins

 

If you look at page 169 of CCFL Handbook you will find a very detailed guide as to how referees should be marked.

 

Sorry MiddleMan but I have to disagree with you on both of these points.

 

As JakesFanClub mentions above, we have been fined this season for attempting to provide constructive criticism that I can assure you was balanced and in no way offensive or personal. If the league wants reliable and accurate markings then why punish clubs for trying to provide them with it? The reports we write are only ever intended to be constructive, but what is the point if there's no obvious retribution? A club gets fined for all sorts of things, quite rightly, but the original point of this thread is very valid - what happens to the referees when they have a poor game? It works on both sides - the league might not deem a report as constructive, but equally us clubs may not deem a referee's performance as 'constructive'! It's all a matter of opinions and stifling them will not help in the long run.

 

As for your second point, page 209 of the 'digital' copy of the handbook shows the league guide to marking referees. This is not detailed in the slightest, it is more a guide to how to count up to 100. The guide essentially boils down to:

 

"The referee was extremely/very/reasonably/quite accurate in decision making, controlled the game extremely/very/reasonably/quite well and communicated extremely/very/reasonably/quite well with the players, establishing extremely/very/reasonably/quite degree of fair play.

Mark as appropriate to choice of extremely/very/reasonably/quite."

 

Tell me, what is constructive about that?!

 

 

 

The Green copy of the Team sheet states "If any area is marked 'poor' or the total mark is 40 or less, detailed, constructive, developmental comments are required". I suspect the fines were issued because the comments (if any) did not conform to this requirement?

[Smudge]

DETAILED,CONSTRUCTIVE,DEVELOPMENTAL,COMMENTS ARE REQUIRED.Could you enlighten us further as to what should be written?MR REFEREES SECRETARY?

Edited February 21, 2011 by Smudge

[Terrence Collina]

I would base it on:

 

Control of game (allowing game to flow, stopping the game, cautions etc)

Time keeping

Appearance

Communication

Application of the laws of the game (although difficult for the majority of those who do not fully understand them)

 

And of course, back up with examples (sounds like GCSE's all over again).

 

 

 

 

 

[Ace1]

DETAILED,CONSTRUCTIVE,DEVELOPMENTAL,COMMENTS ARE REQUIRED.Could you enlighten us further as to what should be written?MR REFEREES SECRETARY?

 

I would agree with this comment Smudge. Someone within the CCL needs to explain what constitutes - Detailed, Constructive and Developmental?????

 

Example: Failed to implement the Laws of Association Football on numerous occassions, would benefit from being assessed and possibly attending a referees refresher course (If there is such a thing?).

 

Is this anywhere near acceptable??????

[catweazle]

I would base it on:

 

Control of game (allowing game to flow, stopping the game, cautions etc)

Time keeping

Appearance

Communication

Application of the laws of the game (although difficult for the majority of those who do not fully understand them)

 

And of course, back up with examples (sounds like GCSE's all over again).

 

 

 

 

 

Absolutely and thank you.

"Started as he meant to go on - absolutely appalling" doesn't qualify as detailed, or constructive or developmental!!!

 

 

[Smudge]

How about,on his performance today Mr. Ref should not give up his day job,as he has no future as a level 4 ref.He arrived on time,smartly dressed 20pts.Thats the developmental part covered.

[catweazle]

How about,on his performance today Mr. Ref should not give up his day job,as he has no future as a level 4 ref.He arrived on time,smartly dressed 20pts.Thats the developmental part covered.

 

I can see why you may be attracting fines!

[Smudge]

How about,on his performance today Mr. Ref should not give up his day job,as he has no future as a level 4 ref.He arrived on time,smartly dressed 20pts.Thats the developmental part covered.

 

I can see why you may be attracting fines!

 

 

I DO NOT ATTRACT FINES,I COLLECT GOLD MEMBERSHIPS.The point we all struggle on is,the powers that be seem to have a rule for everything,a fine for everything,we now live in the year 2011,no more cloak and dagger,everything is out in the open.SO WHY THE SECRECY.But when the powers that be in Football treat us like adults,and conduct their affairs in the open,then us mere mortals would understand more of what goes on..Cash Cow League.

[Krooner]

Just to remind you Smudgey the clubs vote on the rules every year.

 

 

[Smudge]

Just to remind you Smudgey the clubs vote on the rules every year.

 

 

 

Maybe they should take the time to read the small print then.

[Footy Mad]

Just to remind you Smudgey the clubs vote on the rules every year.

 

 

 

Maybe they should take the time to read the small print then.

 

 

Would make sense to make a list of things that have really upset clubs this season and raise them at the AGM???

[Green_Fingers]

Just to remind you Smudgey the clubs vote on the rules every year.

 

 

 

Maybe they should take the time to read the small print then.

 

 

Would make sense to make a list of things that have really upset clubs this season and raise them at the AGM???

 

I doubt if the things that have upset Clubs this season are any different than the things that have upset Clubs in previous seasons and are thus covered by current rules - voted on each season by Clubs and all Clubs will have signed agreements with the League to be bound by those rules.

Changes to rules you may not like won't be easy - you need to have requested them by 31st January (unless you can garnish enough support to call a Special General Meeting).

[Smudge]

Dont think there would be enough hours in the day.1st rule change,A.G.M. to be held at a C.C.L. Club,not the palatial Imber Court,2nd Rule change C.C.L.Cup Finals to be played at C.C.L. Grounds keeping the revenue gained in house.

[Jakesfanclub]

Mr Smudge - referee report forms need to be submitted within 48 hours and are processed on-line, so completing the form following day is a non-issue. Believe me, immediatley following a game is not usually the best time to make a considered judgement! And to our colleague at Guildford, confirm this debate has nothing at all to do with the events of last Saturday. Again - there is no such thing as a fine for a properly completed report form sent within the time frame.

 

 

 

AS I HAVE ALREADY SAID THIS DEBATE HAS NOTHING AT ALL TO DO WITH THE EVENTS OF LAST SATURDAY. There, is that clear enough? This debate was started by Ace1. I have no idea who Ace is but having looked at his previous posts I suspect he may be connected with Farnham Town. I am sure he could confirm it has nothing to do with Guildford City.

[Chris Clapham]

Dont think there would be enough hours in the day.1st rule change,A.G.M. to be held at a C.C.L. Club,not the palatial Imber Court,2nd Rule change C.C.L.Cup Finals to be played at C.C.L. Grounds keeping the revenue gained in house.

 

 

Fair point but how many clubs could host the numbers?

[Ace1]

AS I HAVE ALREADY SAID THIS DEBATE HAS NOTHING AT ALL TO DO WITH THE EVENTS OF LAST SATURDAY. There, is that clear enough? This debate was started by Ace1. I have no idea who Ace is but having looked at his previous posts I suspect he may be connected with Farnham Town. I am sure he could confirm it has nothing to do with Guildford City.

 

This has NOTHING to do with Guildford City!

[Krooner]

Is this thread anything to do with Guildford City ?

[Chris Clapham]

Is this thread anything to do with Guildford City ?

 

Apparently not!