NGU and Promotion

[Krooner]

"*North Greenford United failed to apply by the December 31st deadline. However, due to the circumstances (believed to be a traffic accident) the FA may consider their late application if they finish in an appropriate final league position"

 

Interesting wording don't you think ?

[VPCTFC]

From Mike Avery's site?

Bear in mind that's his own wording - he's not an official FA spokesman.

He does the maps and mileages that another used to do. Just like TK, Mike's maps are only his guess and some people incorrectly think they're official FA plans.

 

Mind you, the official FA site still only lists 69 applicants for step 4 - North Greenford haven't been added. The page has been edited since it was first published. There were originally 64 teams on it.

 

http://www.thefa.com/Leagues/NationalLeagueSystem/NewsAndFeatures/2010/step4-applications-190110

 

But I don't know why there's secrecy when it comes to teams moving upwards, downwards and sideways with some leagues. For instance, is there a definitive list of who can come up from Division 1 this season?

Who's applied to join Div 1 from other leagues? The only one I've seen listed is Hayes Gate from the Middlesex League.

Has anyone officially put in their resignation from Division 1?

Have any teams applied to switch leagues at Premier Division level?

The only thing I can understand there being doubt about is whether we'll be getting Bracknell, AFC Hayes, Walton Casuals or none of them coming down into the CCL this season.

 

After last season's Hartley Wintney / Croydon incident a lot of teams at the bottom of the Prem. this season seem a bit wiser and are preparing themselves for possible relegation.

Even Hanworth Villa last night are looking over their shoulders. I tried to convince them they're safe as it's possible no-one will be coming up and there certainly won't be three coming up but as the Villa fella said - you have to watch out for teams moving across.

 

A lot of leagues publish this info on their websites - a lot don't which just leads to rumours and speculation and teams not knowing what's going on. Why?

 

Sorry Kroons, I've just gone into one again. I'm off work this week so too much spare time on my hands.

[Krooner]

Never mentioned it was an official site VP

 

Not sure I am looking forward to bumping into you tomorrow I think you are full of far too much info that you need to download !!!!

[TRS]

Just nick his anorak Kroons and he'll be lost!

[Fat Boy]

"*North Greenford United failed to apply by the December 31st deadline. However, due to the circumstances (believed to be a traffic accident) the FA may consider their late application if they finish in an appropriate final league position"

 

Interesting wording don't you think ?

 

That's some traffic accident.....................4 months to get to FA HQ

[VPCTFC]

Just nick his anorak Kroons and he'll be lost!

 

You don't know the half of it TRS. I've been doing some right anorak stuff this week - helping a fella out with a database of every Saturday team's home ground in the country. And I mean every one. Nearly full list at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_football_league_system

 

I've been doing the Surrey based leagues. What a boring task that was but it's over now.

Must get around to adding the Wimbledon League and Kingston League to Wikipedia one day....

Edited April 23, 2010 by VPCTFC

[lazarus]

I'll try to help a bit with the current situation, although it should be borne in mind that the League has little influence as to who comes and goes as everything is decided by the FA. once the season is over. To the best of my knowledge the meeting to decide allocations is on Thursday 6 May or at least starts that day, so there may be some delay before we all know what is going to happen.

 

This is how I would currently see it, although I stress that this is a personal view and very "unofficial".

 

Our champions will go up as all three still in contention have been "o'k'd" by the FA, including North Greenford United, whose reason for a late promotion submission was accepted by the FA.

 

The clubs currently in the relegation positions at Step 4 who are in or close to our area are Walton Casuals, Bracknell Town and AFC Hayes. One would expect Walton to come to us, barring any reprieve but the other two are less certain in that Bracknell could be directed to the Hellenic League, although they would have a considerable number of local derbies if they came to us, whilst AFC Hayes would probably go back to the Spartan S Midlands Lg. Everything though is speculation, including the guesses on one or two other web sites, including the successor to the another site. Walton Casuals could still finish outside the relegation positions if they win this afternoon and Ashford Town (Kent) draw or lose.

 

Relegations from our Premier Division will depend upon the above (i.e. how many if any are directed to us from Step 4) plus how many clubs are able to be promoted from Division One, the first requisite being that a top three finish is achieved. Looking at the clubs who could finish in the top three, only Cobham, Hartley Wintney and Mole Valley have the necessary grading to be able to come up. My guess is as good (or bad) as others but at the moment it seems likely that only Mole Valley of that trio is likely to finish in the top three, so the number of relegations from the Premier Division could be reduced. As everyone knows there is speculation over Bedfont's situation but that is all it is at the moment as far as the League is concerned.

 

There have been two applications to join the League from "below". One is Hayes Gate FC who seem likely to finish in a promotion position in the Middlesex County League. They are negotiating a new ground sharing arrangement from their current one and one would think they have a good chance of coming to us. The other is Spelthorne Sports, from the Elite League but they seem unlikely at present to finish in a promotion position.

 

Three clubs have expressed an interest to a greater or lesser degree in a sideways move into the CCL. They have all been advised to contact the Football Association who would make any decisions upon such moves. I must not reveal the names on a public forum in order to protect the relationship between those clubs and their current leagues.

 

Hope that helps a bit but there are often last minute surprises so be prepared for anything!

[VPCTFC]

Thanks for that Whitelaw - you've cleared up a couple of things at least.

 

Regarding sideways moves - I can understand what you're saying re. protecting relationships but I would have thought the clubs would have to tell their current league they're planning on leaving before asking to join the CCL. The rules seem to state that clubs must notify their leagues of withdrawal at the end of the season by December 31st although that's a bit of a risk if you're relying on being voted into the new league by the member clubs, if indeed they have much of a say in it these days.

 

It's been mentioned on TK's forum that it was in the Wessex League bulletin that Farnborough North End may be coming across to Division 1 subject to the CCL and FA's acceptance. The other two could be anyone's guess. Whenever FNE are mentioned, Fleet Spurs always seem to mentioned in the next breath as they're next door to each other although they weren't mentioned by the Wessex League.

 

That just leaves one more issue - relegation from Division 1. Currently one team short but if three new teams come in then that could mean two to be relegated.

 

Interesting times ahead for some.

[Krooner]

Re teams coming across

 

I have heard that Beckenham Town, Binfield and Ascot have expressed an interest. Add to that FNE and take your pick.

 

Of course it could all be speculation.

[VPCTFC]

Binfield I find unlikely as their chairman has been consistant in his slating of the running of the CCL.

Strange coming from someone in the Hellenic League.

 

(where's the Mickey Mouse icon when you need it?)

[lazarus]

The reason for not naming the clubs who may want a sideways move is that they may not have followed it up. Having made an initial enquiry to the League and having been referred to the FA, they may well have decided not to pursue the matter. The League would not necessarily be aware of this.

 

As far as any relegation from Div 1 is concerned, no discussion has yet taken place.

[TRS]

Binfield I find unlikely as their chairman has been consistant in his slating of the running of the CCL.

Strange coming from someone in the Hellenic League.

 

(where's the Mickey Mouse icon when you need it?)

 

 

[Smudge]

Binfield I find unlikely as their chairman has been consistant in his slating of the running of the CCL.

Strange coming from someone in the Hellenic League.

 

(where's the Mickey Mouse icon when you need it?)

 

 

Only available to Gold Members V.P.

[Green_Fingers]

The reason for not naming the clubs who may want a sideways move is that they may not have followed it up. Having made an initial enquiry to the League and having been referred to the FA, they may well have decided not to pursue the matter. The League would not necessarily be aware of this.

 

As far as any relegation from Div 1 is concerned, no discussion has yet taken place.

 

Off topic I know, but commiserations to Whitelaw on his sides (Ashford Town Middx) relegation from Ryman Premier, which was confirmed by yesterdays results.

 

They were a good side when they hammered Badshot Lea in the FA cup last September - not sure how they have slipped so far in such a short time.

 

Good Luck wherever you end up next season - presumably Ryman Div 1 South? along with North Greenford (can't see them slipping up)

[Weeble]

The reason for not naming the clubs who may want a sideways move is that they may not have followed it up. Having made an initial enquiry to the League and having been referred to the FA, they may well have decided not to pursue the matter. The League would not necessarily be aware of this.

 

As far as any relegation from Div 1 is concerned, no discussion has yet taken place.

 

Off topic I know, but commiserations to Whitelaw on his sides (Ashford Town Middx) relegation from Ryman Premier, which was confirmed by yesterdays results.

 

They were a good side when they hammered Badshot Lea in the FA cup last September - not sure how they have slipped so far in such a short time.

 

Good Luck wherever you end up next season - presumably Ryman Div 1 South? along with North Greenford (can't see them slipping up)

I echo those comments....A sad day for all the people of ATFC...there are some people there that have put a lifetime into football but the team has never really had the fan base which is surprising. My heartfelt best wishes go out to all at the club...rebuild and come back stronger...

Good luck.

Edited April 25, 2010 by Weeble

[Terrence Collina]

As much as I would like Bracknell to come into our league next season, I think they will go to the BTK league based on Wokingham and Emmbrooks groundshare with them. What ever league Bracknell go in, they will have local derbies in both (Binfield, Ascot, Wokingham, Reading Town from BTK).

[TRS]

The reason for not naming the clubs who may want a sideways move is that they may not have followed it up. Having made an initial enquiry to the League and having been referred to the FA, they may well have decided not to pursue the matter. The League would not necessarily be aware of this.

 

As far as any relegation from Div 1 is concerned, no discussion has yet taken place.

 

Off topic I know, but commiserations to Whitelaw on his sides (Ashford Town Middx) relegation from Ryman Premier, which was confirmed by yesterdays results.

 

They were a good side when they hammered Badshot Lea in the FA cup last September - not sure how they have slipped so far in such a short time.

 

Good Luck wherever you end up next season - presumably Ryman Div 1 South? along with North Greenford (can't see them slipping up)

 

 

I would have thought NGU would be Ryman 1 North GF?

 

Re Ashford, maybe the loss of the Manager to Margate was a factor although I believe his tenure there was fairly brief.

[Non League Nigel]

Whitelaw - Is it the leagues intention to bring CCL back to 22 teams?

 

If thats the case then with Dorking replacing Mole Valley and Crescent dropping to the elite league CCL 1 would need to take in Hayes Gate and another side

 

If other teams wanted to move over surely the league would struggle with 24 teams due to only half having lights or would those sides with basic facillities be forced out

[VPCTFC]

Whitelaw - Is it the leagues intention to bring CCL back to 22 teams?

 

If thats the case then with Dorking replacing Mole Valley and Crescent dropping to the elite league CCL 1 would need to take in Hayes Gate and another side

 

If other teams wanted to move over surely the league would struggle with 24 teams due to only half having lights or would those sides with basic facillities be forced out

 

The way I see it is just like in the Premier Division - the teams in the relegation places in Division 1 (bottom two) may be sweating a bit - not because of who comes up but because of teams moving across.

 

Last season the FA told leagues that all their step 5 clubs had to have at least an 'F' grade or else face relegation. All the CCL teams did what they had to so it didn't affect us.

I don't know if the FA have now said the same thing must happen to step 6 clubs without the 'G grade. I would have thought there'd be a bit more chatter about it on TK's forum if it has been implemented. If it has, then the bottom two teams without the grading may be relegated from Div 1 before anyone else if the division goes over 22 teams.

 

Mind you, the Sussex League still haven't got all their step 5 (Division 1) clubs up to the standard yet so this season they will be relgating teams based on facilities rather than position in the league.

That's wrong IMO and I do have some sympathy with clubs who may not be able to get their ground up to standard for whatever reason. Of course, those clubs that find money for players but not ground improvements don't have my sympathy.

 

And North Greenford - too far north for Ryman 1(S), too far west for Ryman 1(N) so it'll be the Southern League for them IMO.

Which division? Could be Midlands or SW - they're sort of neatly placed on the border.

 

It all depends on who's going up and down all over the country and any changes the FA may decide to impose on league boundaries this season.

 

Wasn't it easier in the old days when teams just went up or down and knew where they were going?

[lazarus]

I am sure the Premier Division will have 22 teams next season, as usual. If any clubs are transferred into the League by the FA either through relegation or as a sideways move, it will have a bearing upon the number of clubs to be relegated. It could go the other way though and we may not get anyone at all, even to replace our champions (were Walton Casuals to get a reprieve, for example) which could mean that nobody is relegated.

 

As far as Div 1 is concerned, the rules specify that no-one will be relegated if it would leave the division with less than 18 but there is no maximum specified. This season we operated with 21 which is not ideal as you really need an even number fixture wise. My own preference would be for 20, top whack, given that several clubs still do not have floodlights. In the fullness of time I am sure we would like to get to 22.

 

I cannot speculate as to any relegation from Div 1 nor the number of clubs in next season's constitution as the Board/Management Committee will only be discussing it once the season is finally over.