Fans Forum

[Uncle Urchin]

Originally Posted By: Stu M

Lamposts? Don't be silly Dave. They've been nicked and melted down for scrap years ago.

thought you were at a works crimbo party.....?

must have been a boring one...

[Stu M]

I didn't even go in the end... the free booze turned out to be for half an hour and my lift home let me down! By the time I sorted meself out, I went home to drink my beer from my fridge instead.

[Uncle Urchin]

Originally Posted By: Stu M

I didn't even go in the end... the free booze turned out to be for half an hour and my lift home let me down! By the time I sorted meself out, I went home to drink my beer from my fridge instead.

the 7th commandment...never go to works crimbo parties....

sensible...

[Unrecognized Genius]

No lynchings of directors.

No swearwords even.

 

Very quick summary of some of the things said by directors tonight:

 

1. Unless Brian K is a very good liar or a master of political double talk, the debt is nothing like what has been suggested on here. Not even a tenth of some of the estimates.

2. Fleet Leisure's debt cannot act like a millstone around the football club's neck.

3. The Board would have gone after the MyFC deal even if we had reached the 1500+ attendances to make our current expenditure sustainable. The deal would be the equivalent of our achieving 2500 plus attendances.

4. Full time over part time was not significant financially. Jimmy J & Justin S on £400pw part time vs Stacey Long & Mark Ricketts on £300 full time quoted by Roly.

 

Other people feel free to add things or correct any errors

 

 

[Harry J Allstars]

Originally Posted By: Unrecognized Genius

No lynchings of directors.
No swearwords even.

Very quick summary of some of the things said by directors tonight:

1. Unless Brian K is a very good liar or a master of political double talk, the debt is nothing like what has been suggested on here. Not even a tenth of some of the estimates.
2. Fleet Leisure's debt cannot act like a millstone around the football club's neck.
3. The Board would have gone after the MyFC deal even if we had reached the 1500+ attendances to make our current expenditure sustainable. The deal would be the equivalent of our achieving 2500 plus attendances.
4. Full time over part time was not significant financially. Jimmy J & Justin S on £400pw part time vs Stacey Long & Mark Ricketts on £300 full time quoted by Roly.

Other people feel free to add things or correct any errors

UU is going to be devestated, DEVESTATED!!

Thank you UG.

[Unrecognized Genius]

I think you might find that's devastated, H.

 

I doubt it, though. Our avuncular urchin will probably claim to know more than we were told. Personally, I'd be more inclined to believe Brian, but there you go. Maybe I'm a gullible mug.

[Claudius]

I must say this seems to have been an uneventful event.

1.It is very good to hear that the debt is not as high as has been expected.

2.It is also good to hear that Fleet Leisure isn´t going to dictate the future economy of Ebbsfleet United.

3.Why?

4.I still tend to think that full time is more expensive than part time..still full time is needed when aiming for proper league.

UU no doubt is going to be devastated by all this,but he has been devastated before.

He will still post,and that´s the truth Ruth!

[waggamick]

Well....that's all a bit of an anti-climax!

[Uncle Urchin]

Originally Posted By: Claudius

UU no doubt is going to be devastated by all this,but he has been devastated before.

UU is not devastated at all Claudius..why on earth should I be....?

if your Directors have not only managed to remove the 350k worth of debt shown in the audited accounts 2 years ago and also have skilfully managed to avoid further losses during the past 2 seasons then I applaud them and clearly that scenario is an excellent one for the future....it could however be that the debt is accumulating in FL which of course is still at this moment in time a responsibility of its owner EUFCL....only a liquidation of FL would remove the debt and thereby lies the rub of it all as you will find out in due course..

I shall allow for your good cheer this morning as you are not acountants but well meaning and hopeful fans.... I however as previously stated on here... shall await the audited accounts which do not allow for corner cutting on financial matters...debts can be jiggled around and moved and whilst I am not in any way suggesting that such movement has taken place only the full consolodated accounts will show the true position...creditor debt to local suppliers and medium to long term interest bearing debt are two completely different matters...all still debt tho'...directors loans unless written off or capitalised are still club debt...

and whilst replying to you on this fair early xmas morning claudius I must ask why on earth you think that I have been devastated before....you know nothing of me but then again I suppose you read the daily mirror after harry has finished with it...

[KShep]

Another important issue raised was who the debt is owed to; as Brian put it, 'There's debt and then there's debt'.

 

As as I understand it, and correct me if I'm wrong, the club do not owe taxmen or players money, but money is owed to/by directors in loans? This does not seem to be half as severe as what we expected.

 

I was taken aback by the lack of ambition a few of our supporters seem to have. Some valued avoiding relegation a success, every year since we've been here. This is understandable in the first two seasons, but the years after that? The club has an ethos about it of moving forwards, MyFC is innovative and full of potential, as is Eurostar and the Ebbsfleet Valley redevelopment. Whilst we should be thankful that we are playing teams we wouldn't have dreamt of playing ten years ago, as cited last night, we should never take the time to pause and look back. There is so much potential for Ebbsfleet United, potential based on solid foundations, so why not push for the next level? And the level after that?

[Graham S]

Brian did indeed discriminate between the debt that will have you insolvent in no time (like owing the taxman £100,000s) & debt that comes from money owed to directors or loans taken out on an unexpected expense like the refitting of the Plough End.

 

To be fair to our more cautious supporters, they have seen this club survive when others have let ambition make them overreach themselves. To those of us who have seen us struggle in the Southern League Division 1 South, playing the likes of York, Oxford & Exeter on a regular basis does seem a remarkable achievement. It's all about balance & timing. You cannot consolidate for ever, never taking risks, or you stagnate, but you cannot kick on recklessly without the resources to support it. Maybe we will now have those resources.

 

PS I was not one of those possibly over-cautious voices last night & the guy from the New Shopper website is dead if he misquotes what I said to him afterwards

[jc]

Originally Posted By: Unrecognized Genius

4. Full time over part time was not significant financially. Jimmy J & Justin S on £400pw part time vs Stacey Long & Mark Ricketts on £300 full time quoted by Roly.

This may be the case, but it's not really comparing like for like - it's not surprising experienced part-timers are likely to earn more than young full-timers at this level, and this doesn't really provide a price comparison across whole part-time and full-time squads. Full-time and part-time may well cost similar amounts for all I know, but this example doesn't really prove it.

Originally Posted By: KShep

I was taken aback by the lack of ambition a few of our supporters seem to have. Some valued avoiding relegation a success, every year since we've been here. This is understandable in the first two seasons, but the years after that? The club has an ethos about it of moving forwards, MyFC is innovative and full of potential, as is Eurostar and the Ebbsfleet Valley redevelopment. Whilst we should be thankful that we are playing teams we wouldn't have dreamt of playing ten years ago, as cited last night, we should never take the time to pause and look back. There is so much potential for Ebbsfleet United, potential based on solid foundations, so why not push for the next level? And the level after that?

With all factors taken into consideration - budget, ground, fanbase etc. (pre-MyFC at least, which rather complicates matters) - we have arguably punched above our weight for several seasons in this division, so avoiding relegation is a success in a sense.

There's nothing wrong with wanting the Club to kick on and rise up the division(s), but if this develops into a belief that we absolutely must improve every season and never be seen to be just consolidating, this can be detrimental. We've only been close to challenging for the play-offs for one season out of the five we've completed since promotion in 2001/2002, so there isn't really any shame in spending another season in upper-mid-table.

[Hempstead Gaz]

I do find it rather perplexing that for years progress has been very slow, but very steady. Nothing wrong with that, indeed, it meant the club was always financially secured for the long run rather than the rich today, gone tommorrow clubs that have been and gone, and prided itself on that fact.

I wonder, apart from Brian leaving the post of Chairman, what has changed within the club to so radically rethink their ideas regarding name change, going full time, new ground, MyFC - all within 2 or three years?

[Hirsty]

Apologies if this has been mentioned before, or on other threads, but was there an update on the proposed new ground ?

 

Cheers,

[Graham S]

Originally Posted By: jc

Originally Posted By: Unrecognized Genius

4. Full time over part time was not significant financially. Jimmy J & Justin S on £400pw part time vs Stacey Long & Mark Ricketts on £300 full time quoted by Roly.

This may be the case, but it's not really comparing like for like - it's not surprising experienced part-timers are likely to earn more than young full-timers at this level, and this doesn't really provide a price comparison across whole part-time and full-time squads. Full-time and part-time may well cost similar amounts for all I know, but this example doesn't really prove it.

Whilst Roly quoted these specific examples, he did pretty categorically state that going full time had not had any meaningful impact on the cost of the squad as a whole, though obviously the tightness of the purse strings has meant that since becoming full time, the majority of players are only signed up for one season.

However, he & the other directors did seem seriously bothered by the declining attendances, especially as this trend was clear last season, despite having one of the most prolific strikers in the division & being in or on the verge of the play off positions for months on end. They were adamant that the name change had nothing to do with the falling level of support, & that, in the long term, it would work to the Club's advantage.

Hirsty, I asked Bryan about the new ground & he said that work is going on re this all the time & that he has a meeting this Wednesday about it. He added that it was frustrating that he was unable to say anything detailed about progress because this could undo months of negotiation & he understood how it might appear that no progress was being made. He didn't seem to feel that the MyFC involvement would make the new ground more of a certainty financially, as their priority is overwhelmingly with building the team. However, in terms of having specific expertise, amongst so many people, which could be useful, that was quite likely.

[Slartibartfast]

Originally Posted By: Unrecognized Genius

4. Full time over part time was not significant financially. Jimmy J & Justin S on £400pw part time vs Stacey Long & Mark Ricketts on £300 full time quoted by Roly.

So footballers pay is based more on age and experience than full vs part tme?
I am surprised nobody has mentioned that in the past.

[Slartibartfast]

Originally Posted By: jc

With all factors taken into consideration - budget, ground, fanbase etc. (pre-MyFC at least, which rather complicates matters) - we have arguably punched above our weight for several seasons in this division, so avoiding relegation is a success in a sense.

There's nothing wrong with wanting the Club to kick on and rise up the division(s), but if this develops into a belief that we absolutely must improve every season and never be seen to be just consolidating, this can be detrimental. We've only been close to challenging for the play-offs for one season out of the five we've completed since promotion in 2001/2002, so there isn't really any shame in spending another season in upper-mid-table.

Agree 100% with that.

There is nothing wrong with having ambition as long as it doesn't become promotion at all costs.

Interesting too that the MyFC deal was compared to averaging 2,500 for home matches so still lower than Oxford, Torquay, Cambridge, Exeter, and Stevenage.....which means that a play-off place would still mean punching above our weight.

The difference as I see it is that for the past few years as JC rightly said not failing was seen as a success, next season I suspect that not succeding will be classed as a failure.

[chris blanc]

Originally Posted By: Slartibartfast

The difference as I see it is that for the past few years as JC rightly said not failing was seen as a success, next season I suspect that not succeding will be classed as a failure.

I think you're right, which is a shame. I think promotion is a good couple of years away even with a cash injection. Hopefully people won't become dispondant with the whole thing and give up if we don't hit the play offs this season or next

[PatMan]

Promotion is one thing - going up without the necessary preparations in terms of depth of squad will soon have Fleet struggling to survive. This would lead to many problems - ones that simply throwing MyFC cash at will not solve... Not many decent players would be prepared to sign for a club struggling at the bottom of League 2. And any gains that MyFC membership had over promotion, could easily be reversed due to relegation.

 

Therefore, consolidation in this league for another one or 2 seasons, with the benefits of MyFC cash could make promotion not onlt achievable - but also enable Fleet to stay there

[Yorkfox]

Originally Posted By: PatMan

Therefore, consolidation in this league for another one or 2 seasons, with the benefits of MyFC cash could make promotion not onlt achievable - but also enable Fleet to stay there

I agree with you, again !

The problem happens if we happen to go on a good run, maybe with a few new players to boost the squad and we just nick 5th place and get a shot at the playoffs.

Then do we say , we could do with another year or two to get ready ? Might not happen I know, but I guess if we get the sniff of it, we have to go for it, and if we happen to pull it off, we have a few months over the summer to try and bulk up the squad a bit. But that is likely something we will have to do anyway.

Everything is up in the air, nobody knows what will happen, and that what makes it wonderful and scary all at the same time.

Oxford going out of the trophy got my attention. The big teams are starting to fall. A good performance at Dorchester and then a good draw , a few more big teams draw each other and we really will start thinking dangerous thoughts.